DPS Gauge, non number generated

[Bubba_Drunk]

Everyone loves to know how well they are doing for DPS, but having actual numbers to throw around is a bit obtrusive, just a thought but a DPS gauge showing you, and possibly your party how well you're doing would be nice.

Here's the idea, give the player a UI module that shows a bar much like the hate meter does below your name, base the bar around the run's "comfortable" dps ceiling (ignoring high numbers that are maxing out the meter within a given range so as to ignore excessive dps to prevent arguments ect). No actual numbers are needed, just a rough idea for you and the party to see if you're doing well enough or with-in acceptable margins.

Basing DPS off the hate meter is redundant, because your tank may not be pushing enough enmity in the first place. As a comprimise, I think this would work very well, and help to improve quality of life in the game overall, without even needing to know exacts.

[KingOfAbyss]

Everyone loves to know how well they are doing for DPS (NOPE, not everyone cares for the numbers)

Here's the idea, No actual numbers are needed (The End - no more problems)

I think this would work very well, and help to improve quality of life in the game overall, without even needing to know exacts.

Heya ^^

I just edited your post with my comments in bold to show my opinions on this.

Another DPS meter debate.

"just a rough idea for you and the party to see if you're doing well enough or with-in acceptable margins."

For me, If you go into T9, end up after a few wipes on the same run, to beat it.. it means your party did well. No well-enough or acceptable.

--> What is acceptable margins? Last boos at 1%? Still lost.. pointers to you or the entire teamwork?

I would be all for numbers, I remember being a glass cannon in other games, where my Mage Crits where beautiful. Oh my..

Thing is, no matter how you want to put it, people will ask for screenshots and set a predefined min lvl - else you are kicked. (else how can you pretend you are 'that' good?)

So far in this game though.. so much Hate towards the players instead of monsters - so many PF parties where you need to be X and Y else don't bother or be kicked after one wipe.. kills the fun for lots, as per my experience from me and some other mates on my server.

SE should go the opposite way - remove all numbers! only a popup shaking window when someone lands a crit!

Now, people will assemble together and accept everyone - and check their skills on the spot.

You might easily catch who's not using all their skills to the max benefit of everyone - instead of kicking him, suggesting goes a long way..

Good Communication through chat or Voice - improvement of said person - down the bosses - everyone wins.

Else

SE set min DPS limits just like iLvl min requirements to every dungeons/trials.

End

[Bubba_Drunk]

This point is to improve QOL. As a prior Assistant GM, and current static leader. I know that people will want certain things from the their party to begin with, so they can rely upon them to a certain degree. Its to easy to blame one another because of lack of accountability, the current debate is how far to push the thresh-hold on things like this without compromising it completely for the new players/casual raiders. Some people are going to go so far as to download parsers and break rules regardless of the fairness of it or not. I'm not suggesting a meter btw, just a simple UI bar.

Hiding even more things from the users is just going to hurt that aspect even more, more over it gives even more incentive to both sides of that coin to do so. While I personally dislike DPS meters, many people feel they are an absolute for raids, one thing we did in the old guild was demand that no-body discuss those numbers, especially during raid.

We don't have any in-game options for this currently, and for the largest aspect its based on feel of the run, you can watch the numbers on screen and know that they seem high and yet you're dps can still be low, and if you feel so compelled time it yourself for a rough DPS calculation. New players and the casuals will largely refuse to do this because its not exactly fun for most people (especially for people not accustomed to this sort of game, which in itself shuns those same people again). For the learning curve the game is currently in, it only feels like an oversight to not help the new players to manage their DPS.

--> What is acceptable margins? Last boss* at 1%? Still lost.. pointers to you or the entire teamwork?

Whatever SE deems to set them at. Currently, they've only acknowledged that BLM may not be a character people would want to bring to Coil, but other than raiding, there is no problems with the classes and probably working as intended.

SE set min DPS limits just like iLvl min requirements to every dungeons/trials.

They also know the comfortable-high limits too, all this suggestion is trying to do is give a simple bar to show that, while also ignoring the extreme's (to much dps). People don't download an enmity meter because the in-game one is good enough to get the job done, even if it doesn't tell you the whys. The DPS bar I'm suggesting is the same principle, and it would be largely useless, but good enough to let you know (on the fly) if you're doing plenty of DPS and can relax (thus focus more on what others are doing or the encounter itself, specifically for me this lets me know HOW to help the others.)

Good Communication through chat or Voice - improvement of said person - down the bosses - everyone wins.
Thing is, no matter how you want to put it, people will ask for screenshots and set a predefined min lvl - else you are kicked. (else how can you pretend you are 'that' good?)
So far in this game though.. so much Hate towards the players instead of monsters - so many PF parties where you need to be X and Y else don't bother or be kicked after one wipe.. kills the fun for lots, as per my experience from me and some other mates on my server.

If you don't make certain tools readily available, the new players and casuals have no reason to try to improve themselves if they don't feel the incentive, the reason why there is so much "hate" towards people is because of this. Its to keep the people out who have no reason being there in the first place, if you use something like DF/PF there is no reason to prove yourself to these people and can maybe sneak a win.

I just edited your post with my comments in bold to show my opinions on this.

No offence meant, but what you suggested sounds like it would actually make the game slightly more boring, many people LOVE seeing those huge numbers, even IF they know their dps, healing, or hate abilities aren't up to par. Any DD worth their salt, likes to DPS well...otherwise whats the point? o.O

What you're, in effect, saying is its ok to let bad people be bad, and while I can accept the occasional crappy player (if they can get the job done) I don't prefer running with people who can't meet the minimums of the easiest job. I myself am a pretty decent tank, but I refuse to tank in FF because these same people seem to want to blame me when they're the reason we wipe in the first place, and then people wonder why more tanks don't run DF/PF. If a tank is a bad tank, if a healer is a bad healer, its obvious, but if a bad DD is bad, its ok (and not readily obvious)?

To close on what you said, DDs are meant to DPS, there is already minimum requirements for each run, that's the lowest you can DPS on the given mobs and just barely pull off a win (so you don't suck, but well honestly you're not that good), however it also means you're not using your character anywhere near close enough to its acceptable ranges and may as well just be mashing buttons, you're going to be carried either way at that point if they run is successful, raid or not. The bar being suggested is to serve such a purpose, without flaunting numbers. The game is currently set up with minor DPS checks here and there, any decent DD doesn't even have to worry about them, if you are worrying about them, its probably not you that needs to be worrying in the first place.

I'm not a fan of carries, however I do not mind giving new people a shot, lack of willingness to TRY is NOT acceptable in my book though, for obvious reasons. If you're lazy, or suck, and are content with being that way, then you're wasting time for the party and don't deserve to be a part of it especially if the others are trying to push their characters and themselves. We currently had a bard who is brand new to MMOs, and is trying her heart out to meet expectations we haven't even set before she allows herself to even raid with us, and for that we love her her to death, without parsers or help from anyone she can hold her own quite well atm, yet considers herself NOT to be good enough to try yet, ironic isn't it?

I probably should have said most of this in the first post, but I was surprised to see the only comment was strictly adverse to the general concept, without even being in line with the original idea that spawned the post. Hmm. Sorry for some rambling, I'm tired T-T

[Darske]

DPS gauges or meters of any kind provide incentive for people to discriminate against eachother based on their current gear, regardless of whether or not it actually matters for a win. Just look at the minimum ilvls in party finder, they're usually a good ten to twenty ilvls higher than they need to be.

The concept might not be inherently bad, but it opens the door for players to be even more discriminatory than they already are, and that should be avoided at all costs, imo.