NINJA and ROGUE confirmed

[Ulathskullsplitter]

I didn't get to watch the stream but something I have not seen anyone mention yet is where this rogue guild is going to be. Did they say in the live stream? Of the existing cities LL makes the most sense since it still has less guilds than the other 2 cities. But that's only because the musketeers guild isn't being used yet. If they add it to mor dhona that would make it impossible to have it as a starting class for new players.

[Bigpurpleharness]

I didn't get to watch the stream but something I have not seen anyone mention yet is where this rogue guild is going to be. Did they say in the live stream? Of the existing cities LL makes the most sense since it still has less guilds than the other 2 cities. But that's only because the musketeers guild isn't being used yet. If they add it to mor dhona that would make it impossible to have it as a starting class for new players.

Given Limsa is full of sea-thieves, and Thancred and the Doman are being told to instruct the city in their forms of combat in the main story quest, I'd bet Limsa.

[Scott]

Pretty sad its Rogue > Ninja.

I was hoping for a dual Job like Arcanist

Rogue > Ninja > Thief

[Kitru]

I was hoping for a dual Job like Arcanist

Rogue > Ninja > Thief

And how exactly would THF work as a job that's complimentary to NIN? Jobs only get 5 abilities, and it's pretty simple logic to realize that they're not going to have 2 jobs (whether from the same class or from different ones) that play almost identically, which, thanks to the number of job abilities provided (and the fact that they're provided at 30, 35, 40, 45, and 50) can't happen with 2 jobs of the same role off of the same class (unless you have the job change so many abilities from the base class that it becomes a completely *different* class, which beggars the question of why they didn't just design a new class altogether).

Yoshi has said that NIN is going to be DPS because having it as a tank is ludicrous which means that THF would have to be DPS. He has also said that they're only going to add jobs that fulfill a currently vacant niche (of course, both of these statements should be patently obvious to anyone that has the slightest inkling of what game development entails). So contemplate this:

What role would THF fulfill that isn't DPS? Support isn't a role, it's a subrole (and wouldn't make the class play differently anyways), so that's right out. It makes no sense for THF to be a healer since it's never had anything resembling those capabilities. It makes even *less* sense for THF to be a tank because THF has always had abilities to *avoid* fights and has taken hits only marginally better than a caster (and, in fact, worse than MNK or DRG has). People make the claim that it could *possibly* be a hybrid, but it takes a major stretch of the imagination to see THF performing the same functions as a RDM. There *isn't* a role for THF to occupy.

What niche would THF fill that isn't taken up by ROG and NIN? ROG and NIN are already the light armored, dual dagger wielding, stealthy class that uses poisons. WAR is the martial tank while PLD is the "holy" tank. WHM is the traditional healer while SCH is the pet/shield healer. SMN is the standard DPS caster while SMN is the DoT/pet DPS caster. DRG is medium armored spear using DPS (less positioning requirements) while MNK is light armored "unarmed" DPS (more positioning requirements). There *isn't* a niche remaining for THF to occupy.

There is absolutely no reason that anyone can come up with that we will ever get THF beyond "Yoshi hasn't said we're not getting it". As I have said over and over and over again, if you actually *look* at what evidence there is (without trying to twist it and find a loophole to create an out for yourself whereupon you're not looking at the evidence; you're trying to find a way around it), it's plain to see that the closest we're getting to THF is ROG (and, it could *easily* be argued, that ROG *is* THF).

[Bigpurpleharness]

Stuff

Steal-Stats (STR/DEX/INT/etc)
Steal-Attributes (Evasion/Accuracy/Defense/Attack)
Stealth attacks
Mug (Increases party gil drop by a minor amount of inflicts damage)
Trick Attack (Deals increased damage for next ability and transfers hate to party member)

I could go on, and all of these are just from two FF titles. I'd argue your "NIN as a tank is ludicrous!" line is in fact more ludicrous than "Thieves wouldn't be welcome in a city of sea-thieves in a world that encourages dark arts users, thievery already, assassinations, and will literally in the same patch put in a class that is pretty much always described lore-wise as unethical assassins. There's precedent for one, there is no precedent and (evidence to the contrary) for the other.

That being said, I agree they're not adding Thief. I disagree with the reasoning though. As anyone should, saying thieves wouldn't be morally acceptable with a city of literal sea-thieves being in existence, and now an assassin job is just asinine.

[LoLo]

Thief tank? I can't with this thread anymore lol

[MartaDemireux]

Thief tank? I can't with this thread anymore lol

There are at least two current MMO's that use a rogue-type tank effectively. Rift and Wildstar. It is also present in SWTOR but I haven't experience in that game.

[LoLo]

There are at least two current MMO's that use a rogue-type tank effectively. Rift and Wildstar.

Oh, ok. I am totally ignorant to both games. I pretty much only play this game because it is a Final Fantasy.

[Bigpurpleharness]

Oh, ok. I am totally ignorant to both games. I pretty much only play this game because it is a Final Fantasy.

There are more than that, SW:TOR also uses assassin/shadow tanks. It can be done, for sure. I just want thief, they could make it any role they want as long as it's fun and useful.

[shanvhere]

Wonder if Ninja will be tank or damage