Summoner - Acc vs Det/Crit

[Zamii]

added a stat weighting to the findings, it surprised me when i saw it in comparison to the weighting for determination, had to double check to make sure it was actually correct lol.

[Judge_Xero]

For those that make BiS lists based upon stat weightings:
each point of accuracy below cap should have a value of -0.255

So if this is the stat weighting for Accuracy, then is this how it would work with Garuda?

Accuracy -0.255/4 = 0.06375 (Relative to Damage % Compared to Master)
Add in the extra Damage Stats - 0.217 Crit, 0.2 DET / 4 (Averaged out at 0.052 per stat)
So totalled out as 0.01175 in a 1:1 Ratio to Accuracy (Because while Pets average is reduced by accuracy, it is increased by Damage stat) - much more complex considering damage stats are indirectly effected by accuracy, but close enough for comparison

So as long as the Summoner is at 100% accuracy, each point of Crit/DET has a stat weighting of 17 compared to Accuracy for Summoner Pet? (0.208/0.01175)

Please critique.

Edited: Proposed BiS - http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/MULX
Can swap out either, Evenstar Boots and Hat for High Allagan Boots and Hat

[Dwill]

snip

You can't divide the -0.255 by 4 because that value is specific to Garuda missing since she is the one needing to be at 491, not the summoner himself. I'd warrant that the acc weight for being under cap would be much higher if it was being calculated at going under 471.

So to break even at 471, if the value of -0,255 is good, you'd need 5.1 worth of value from stats weight with CRT being 0,2 and Det being 0,163 and S.Speed being a whooping 0.022 to 0.081 depending on the encounter's time (all of the value being calculated at the summoner being accuracy capped).

continuing in the next post...

[ticdup]

So to break even at 471, if the value of -0,255 is good, you'd need 5.1 worth of value from stats weight with CRT being 0,2 and Det being 0,163 and S.Speed being a whooping 0.022 to 0.081 depending on the encounter's time (all of the value being calculated at the summoner being accuracy capped).

Where did you get a weight of DET being less than CRIT for Summoner?

[Dwill]

Where did you get a weight of DET being less than CRIT for Summoner?

http://sim.ffxivguild.net/

[Infina]

http://sim.ffxivguild.net/

Just tried the SMN sim, here's the rotation it used for 5 mins sim

raging-strikes rouse spur bio miasma bio-ii swiftcast shadow-flare fester ruin ruin ruin ruin bio fester ruin ruin miasma ruin fester aetherflow bio-ii shadow-flare bio ruin fester ruin ruin ruin ruin fester ruin ruin rouse ruin ruin miasma swiftcast shadow-flare fester ruin bio ruin bio-ii ruin ruin ruin ruin fester raging-strikes bio-ii ruin rouse bio ruin ruin swiftcast shadow-flare ruin ruin ruin ruin ruin ruin ruin ruin aetherflow miasma fester bio ruin bio-ii shadow-flare fester ruin ruin ruin bio miasma fester ruin ruin rouse spur ruin ruin bio miasma bio-ii aetherflow bio swiftcast shadow-flare fester ruin ruin miasma ruin fester ruin ruin bio

and for garuda

wind-blade aerial-blast wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade contagion wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade contagion wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade contagion wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade wind-blade

Still quite far from being reliable compared to T0rin's (outdated) sim

[Judge_Xero]

You can't divide the -0.255 by 4 because that value is specific to Garuda missing since she is the one needing to be at 491, not the summoner himself. I'd warrant that the acc weight for being under cap would be much higher if it was being calculated at going under 471.

So to break even at 471, if the value of -0,255 is good, you'd need 5.1 worth of value from stats weight with CRT being 0,2 and Det being 0,163 and S.Speed being a whooping 0.022 to 0.081 depending on the encounter's time (all of the value being calculated at the summoner being accuracy capped).

continuing in the next post...

Oh I see. I wasn't sure if that was the stat weight of Acc, for just Garuda, or in general. It does make sense, since it looks like Acc is weighted higher than the Primary stats.
-5 Acc below cap = 1%
6.5 Main stat = 1% extra damage

Thanks for catching about dividing Garuda's stat weight by 4. Even though she may do a 1/4 of overall SMN damage, it's 1/3 of SMN's actual damage.

I didn't include food with the gear set I posted.

BiS - 502 Acc - 523 Crit - 294 Det - 405 S.Speed
Me - 471 Acc - 542 Crit - 282 Det - 435 S.Speed

So for Garuda -4% Accuracy (96% DPS) + 1.2% for S.Speed + 0.6% from Crit (- 0.3% from DET) - so a 2.2% Loss for Garuda (97.8 DPS)

Summoner +4.1 weight - 0.6% Increase (relative to Garuda 1.8% - so overall it's a 0.4% loss)

Still pretty interesting

[Dwill]

snip

Pets are not affected by food buff so it didn't matter that you forgot it. And with all the information we gathered thus far, she's more 1/4 than 1/3 of our damage.

Their also is a bug where Garuda (or any pet for that matter) is unaffected by S.Speed so we can't apply this to her (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ed-Pet-Actions).

So acc caped still is the most important then CRT > DET > S.SPEED.

[Zamii]

Pets are not affected by food buff so it didn't matter that you forgot it. And with all the information we gathered thus far, she's more 1/4 than 1/3 of our damage.

Their also is a bug where Garuda (or any pet for that matter) is unaffected by S.Speed so we can't apply this to her (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ed-Pet-Actions).

So acc caped still is the most important then CRT > DET > S.SPEED.

i remember seeing somewhere that SS did affect pets, but just the tooltip didnt update. havent tested myself to see if its true though.

As far as I'm aware, one of the upcoming patches will make pet account caps the same as the smn. I think it may be 2.3, but I'm not 100% on that info.

i'll sure be happy if they do, but at the same time this thread will become a giant slap in the face for all the theory crafting lol

[Dwill]

snip

Current BiS is http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/MQDG with 533 CRT, 308 DET and 405 S.peed
Your proposed list is http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/MULX with 542 CRT, 282 DET and 435 S.Speed.

The difference of stats in term of weights is:

CRT = +1.8
DET = -4.238
S.Speed= +2.43

So in the end, you're not even breaking even with acc cap weights. With acc being under the cap values being adjusted, you'd be losing damage.

So this comes back to my previous point earlier in the thread that dropping below acc is just not worth it.