Please move the game away from grind and towards skill

[Legacy_Wolfwood]

the 75 day time frame imo is to hold novus till 2.3 when a few things happen with the ilvl increase...

1. 3rd coil. new higher allagan wep.
2. ramuh. new ilvl weps.
3. possibly another type of wep that you can get from tomes/coil that is just under the new allagan wep kinda like the unidentifieds.
4. the new relic upgrade which will always be a grind.
5. number 2 and 3 will probably have an upgrade mechanic like mirrors/sands/oil type

coil = skill/rng, ramuh = skill/rng, possible random tome drop wep = rng/skill/grind, relic upgrade = pure grind/rng

being that atm the choices are coil for 2 weps, levi for 1 and mirror, and the relic line. relic is fine being the pure grind wep. besides, you dont NEED novus to beat whats currently out atm and possibly wont be 100% needed till 2.3 and even then i bet you can still get by with whats available for awhile.

all complaints come from: "It takes too long, i dont want to run coil, and I want it now"

[Orophin]

the 75 day time frame imo is to hold novus till 2.3 when a few things happen with the ilvl increase...

There won't be an ilvl increase in 2.3, that will be 2.4. 2.3 is CT2 and Ramuh which are going to drop i100 items.

To the OP - If you want the Novus to be something skill based, yet limit the rate of completion, (from the perspective of the developers) then it's going to need to be something similar to the original relic quest, only tuned to the difficulty of T9. This won't work because it will exclude most of the players of the game by not giving casual/less skilled/uninterested people who can't/don't want to run Coil an upgrade option.

[Legacy_Wolfwood]

There won't be an ilvl increase in 2.3, that will be 2.4. 2.3 is CT2 and Ramuh which are going to drop i100 items.

thanks for the correction. but still. 1 of the many options being pure grind is fine considering everything else is more skill based

[ToffeeCoffee]

I just hope that when the 3rd Coil is released, and the decision is made to put 2nd Coil into DF with the silly lockout removed, that they do NOT apply the Echo buff to 2nd Coil as soon as they did the last one. Hoping it's not added at all but that's wishful thinking.
There are skilled players who don't have a static group for 2nd Coil, who have a lot of trouble finding competent PUGs to clear for the week, among other factors. Some of those players are arguably more skilled and talented than those who are lucky enough to have a well organised static and easily clear it every week - do not deserve to be insulted with nerfs/echo. Please save the non-Echo party finder suggestion, it's hard enough finding people as it is without filtering down the amount of available competent players even more.

[Nicobo]

I just hope that when the 3rd Coil is released, and the decision is made to put 2nd Coil into DF with the silly lockout removed, that they do NOT apply the Echo buff to 2nd Coil as soon as they did the last one. Hoping it's not added at all but that's wishful thinking.
There are skilled players who don't have a static group for 2nd Coil, who have a lot of trouble finding competent PUGs to clear for the week, among other factors. Some of those players are arguably more skilled and talented than those who are lucky enough to have a well organised static and easily clear it every week - do not deserve to be insulted with nerfs/echo. Please save the non-Echo party finder suggestion, it's hard enough finding people as it is without filtering down the amount of available competent players even more.

A lot of people have suggested that turning of the echo by yourself for this situation ^^;

[ToffeeCoffee]

A lot of people have suggested that turning of the echo by yourself for this situation ^^;

I do turn Echo off, that doesn't mean I'll be able to convince the other 7 players. I'll re-iterate that it's already hard enough to find competent players to clear Coil 2 without trying to set up a PF for non-echo.
Players who are deliberately waiting for nerfs/echo before attempting content should not be encouraged by SE. Why are casuals being catered to but people who are progression minded (not hardcore) are left in the lurch? Is it because casuals make up most of the subscription $$$ proceeds?

I'll leave this thread with some quotes from a casual player from my server on the current state of Coil 2/endgame in ARR:
"the same "glorified content" you ARE working hard on will become laughably easy to farm"
"no one really cares about progression because it's moot in the end, you guys are just grinding vanity items..."

[Ooshima]

No, but give grind a skill/fun alternative. Even if that means more time spent on it, it would be quality time.

They did. Second coil of Bahamut. It is skill, it is fun, and it takes lots of time to practice and clear it. And you get top notch loots.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Many good points made here. And I understand the need for something like the Zodiac Saga grind/non-skill based progresion - something for everyone, right?

But here's an example of the worst case scenario I thought, then actually saw happen: I swing by Mor Dhona yesterday, and someone's in PF and shouting for members for a T5 run. I wanted to join. BADLY. But I was already committed to helping an FC mate who's a fresh 50. Anyways, someone replies to the shout "T5?I dunno, sounds like less time to do Alexandrite farming."

Felt like my soul just got Geocrushed right there. Welcome to FFXIV now folks. Why challenge content you're more than likely geared for at this point, when you can just settle into a long grind and eventually get results? Endgame? Why bother when you can just farm/speedrun quick dungeons for tomes? Sure, some aren't interested in BCOB/SCOB just like I'm not interested in Zodiac. But what are you going to do once you get that Novus weapon? Stand around in Mor Dhona flaunting it, and STILL not even trying to take on a bigger challenge? I mean, hey, your game, your tailored experience as you like it. But for every person who opts for the "easy" grind, that's one less person to run harder content with. And being one of those people that doesn't mind the challenge, it's a bit disappointing to see something like that.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

I'll leave this thread with some quotes from a casual player from my server on the current state of Coil 2/endgame in ARR:
"the same "glorified content" you ARE working hard on will become laughably easy to farm"
"no one really cares about progression because it's moot in the end, you guys are just grinding vanity items..."

Oh the irony of that statement. Coil 2 weapons are STILL better than the Animus weapons (not sure about Novus, and don't care either. I am quite resolute when I say SE completely turned me off to it the way they addressed the MASSIVE bad reception the Atma grind alone got.) So if anything is a vanity now, it'd be those glowing grind trophies people "worked" so hard for.

[HazelNyan]

I fail to see the problem.
The "skill" alternative is already here and it is called Second Coil of Bahamut.
Novus is i110, HA weapon is i115. There is no reason to get a Novus weapon to be able to beat T9. It is just "skill".