Remove Enrage Timers

[Noahlimits]

First off, I have nothing personally against enrage timers. The whole point of this topic is that SE clearly said that they are against people parsing (by saying they won't ever make their own in battle one); which I'm totally okay with. It's their game, they run it as they see fit. With that being said, I feel like putting in enrage timers goes against that whole philosophy. I am not advocating parsing and I personally have never done so. But I can't help but feel that making hard to reach enrage timers strongly goes against that.

Second, it seems like a bunch of people have selective reading.

Enrage timers exist for two purposes;

1. It prevents healer stacking. You could otherwise bring 3-4 healers to every fight and have a much easier time unless there are harsh dps checks throughout.

You will see PF looking for 1 tank 7 healers party as common if no enrage timer.

For Raenryong's second unquoted point, I'm not arguing with that. But it's very hard to tell if you're cutting the mustard on a high end fights if you have a semi-decent rotation since they aren't making their own for in game. Yes, they aren't needed if someone is obviously doing a very bad rotation. But if someone is doing a semi-not-super-terribad rotation, it would otherwise be hard to tell if their dps was the reason for the hard enrage. Thank Jeebus I'm a healer and don't have to worry about DPS much, right?

I very clearly said in my original post:

I understand one of the reasons for enrage timers is because otherwise parties would just stock up on 5+ healers to grind out wins in content that they aren't ready for (think t2 enrage). For this reason, I'd suggest locking in required slots for raiding (2 tanks, 2 healers, 4 dps). This would prevent one tanking strategies, but SE has shown that they don't like that in the first place (introducing forced tank swapping stacks, and what brainjack was originally supposed to do in T8 before people found a way to circumvent that).

Let me tell you a story about the time I got Titan HM in the Trial Roulette.

I was playing Paladin, and had a SCH healer we were the only 2 that could dodge stuff. Everyone else was dead at about 45% or so left to go because they were bad at dodging. But me and the healer decided to keep going, neither of us made any mistakes. I had to bust him out of the rock so many times, fought Titan for 35 min before he died. The sch used the LB3 at 5% raised like 3 guys that didn't fall out, even then during that 5% 2 of them managed to get killed again.

That is why we have enrage timers because a few people can carry everyone else that is unskilled at the fight and take as long as you want to win.

How is this any different than people carrying other players now?

It wasn't AV it was Pandemonium Warden that the group took 18 hours. Guess what square did in response to that. Put enrage timers on him and AV.

But our instances already have 60-90 minute timers for most difficult end game content. That situation isn't even possible unless there was a boss that wasn't in a instance that was of high difficulty (no, Odin and Behemoth don't count as hard bosses).

[Sove92]

One thing i would like to see changed is the HARD enrage of bosses, dealing more damage cannot be the reason a party wipe to a boss.

This is the basic problem in hard enrages. It's an equivalent of "You have hit me enough, now face my true power", which makes no sense because the boss wouldn't let you kill it if it had such a powerful attack. Twintania can be excused with the collar holding back her power (after phase 4 Profusion, she needs to charge up before she can spam it), but many other enrages, not so much.

Either way, they exist for a reason and are not going away.

[Fynlar]

could have just read it as simple fix report the harrassers being rude because someone is doing low dps is against the rules and should be reported people see what they want too not what is actually being said.

Could have, but didn't. Again, because you're (still) not employing some basic punctuation signs that would clearly indicate when one statement is ending and another is beginning.

If you aren't going to write properly, don't expect people to read it properly.

[L-Lihzeh]

no I soloed a raid boss with my tank and had the Enrage timer go off when there health bar was be low the LV in there name
so they were not killing me given I lasted that long the timer was the only thing that stopped me.

so yeah they need to be reworked or at lest disable it with unrestricted parties
(also that is how i just learned that timer was even in the game lol )

the guy I was replying to is not quoted ..ah well bed time

[Vandso]

I disagree
Parsing is the fun of the game

[Burmecia]

I disagree
Parsing is the fun of the game

You can still parse, whether there was enrage or not.

Wow, this is one vintage thread.

[Sylvain]

The issue is that, enrage timer is basically the 'dps check'

If you play dps and there's no enrage timer, then you're in all practicality useless.

It would be akin to removing unavoidable damage in combat, which is why healer are here, to top you off after you've been hit by something you can't dodge. If those didn't exist or were too weak, healer would be useless.

DPS check in this game are very lenient, (beside DSR+TOP or week1-2 savage prog).
If you hit the boss enrage, it means that either your group as a whole had too many death, or that the players overall don't play nearly well enough.

I main healer and I tend to be on the more "careful side", so i tend to shoot an extra heal sometime "just to be safe" (Especially in EX trial with people getting hit by random stuff all the time). Damage is just a filler, a contribution, like healing. My goal is to kill the boss. My main role is to heal, if there's nothing to heal, I just dps. And it does add up.

If we reach an enrage timer, beside when progging in TOP or DSR, I really never ever felt concerned about my DPS. Considering how lenient the dps check are this xpac. We surely didn't wipe because I casted 2 extra MedicaII in that fight. We should not be 600 potency short.

What I'm concerned is that my group passes healing check, that when the boss throws 3-4 aoes back to back that we survive. Healers have healing check, DPS(and tank) have DPS check.

I mean, I would feel aweful to play a DPS knowing that "no matter how bad I am, as long as healer can keep me alive, I can finish that fight"
Why play DPS at this point if you're that useless? Let's just all play glaremage with 2 tanks, this way, 100% success rate as there's a bajillion heals.

[TheMightyMollusk]

Almost a ten year necro. That's a deep dive.

[Sylvain]

This is the basic problem in hard enrages. It's an equivalent of "You have hit me enough, now face my true power", which makes no sense because the boss wouldn't let you kill it if it had such a powerful attack. Twintania can be excused with the collar holding back her power (after phase 4 Profusion, she needs to charge up before she can spam it), but many other enrages, not so much.

Either way, they exist for a reason and are not going away.

TBH they could simply just make enrage look cooler, like the boss does an unavoidable pattern. Basically, he figured out what was wrong with his strat and just finishes you.
Or something cool, a bit lore related like the enrage of P12S part 2. A boring hard cast but with a wonderful animation.

Hard enrage should just look like soft enrage.

[Sylvain]

omg yeh didn't notice. i was indeed bored today