Shocked at the reduction in mage damage, quadruple mp cost, and lowered resources

[Neptune]

I think this has been the best succession of posts I've read in this thread.

I read up to about page 24. I think a LOT of people are missing the point here.

The OP isn't asking for afk 'easy mode' healing, he's saying that for anyone who didn't want to be stuck at the back, reserving MP for heals only, are now stuck at the back, reserving their MP for heals only.

I played FFXI, my main was a WHM and to be honest, it was dull, so dull infact that i changed my main to PUP, way more fun! As WHM, more often than not, you end up eating cookies and resting while everyone else gets to play the game.

That's where i thought XIV had it right, a mage that could do quests on their OWN without fear of dying after one hit; a mage capable of benefiting a party with more than just heals. I totally agree that DoM needed tweaking but typecasting them into specific roles was/is not the answer.

I liked the prospect that this game was going to be different, classes could be played to the players specification. Why should a person who wants to nuke be forced into playing a healer? Would a PGL be happy playing the role of a healer while all their fun attacks get left behind to reserve their mp for heals; spending half there time inactive to regain MP needed for said heals? (Imagine that TP didn't exist and all skills used MP, that way you might sympathise a little more).

I know that there is still much to be done in regards to the battle system (and the game in general) but i think that a lot of you should try and see this from both sides of the coin.

Just because mage's have always been squishy and acted as healers in the past, why should that stereotype stay the same when it's boring? I think that MMO's are all falling into the same trap where you must have the standard set-up of at least 1 tank (who isn't MP based); a squishy mage to heal, but not for anything else (except maybe the odd buff/ debuff when MP allows); and then a couple of DD's in order to succeed in doing anything. Who says tanks need to be melee based? Why can't they be magic based? Why can't healers throw a nuke or two or three or four? I think it's terrible when you can't play a game because you can't find a tank or healer to party with.

Eventually we're gonna have to pay to play this game, and time spent seeking parties is money being thrown away, doing nothing. That is definitely one thing i won't miss from XI.

Apologies for the wall of text.

Good job for reading that far. It's really been a pain arguing with insensitive and indecent people in this thread and now I'm wondering why I ever spent more than 2 seconds on cries of "easy mode".. I guess I was offended. Your post really highlights the issue at hand.

That makes no sense though. Conjurer IS the healer and nuke class. Either you heal or nuke. Whats the issue? If you play with friends/linkshell, they will let you go as nuke Conjurer. I know mine does. You can even throw a few heals in an emergency if you want. If you are a HEALER in an MMO though, you only need to be healing, and removing debuffs from players.

I follow what you're saying, but you haven't taken everything into account. Not everyone can play during "ls events" or primetime. I know my schedule doesn't allow for that. When you are struggling to find players to do something, or you want to do something that isn't popular or more than 5 minutes old, guess what, there is a shortage of players. And anything but an abundance of players who want to main heal means that takes away from the game's enjoyability. I can recall countless times in FFXI where I had to main heal as RDM because no one could find a main healer. It's very frustrating, and as Bramble just noted, all that frustration was nullified by this game's revolutionary curing by aoe system that took the hassle out of back-up curing.

The issue is that because of these changes, even on the JP forms players have developed a "what are you doing wasting MP on elemental spells? heal me you dumbdumb" mentality. If you for example are you starting off in the game and don't have your "friends/linkshell" do you really think people are going to let you play offensively with a Conjurer now?

Edit:

When I first saw this game and was wondering what class I was going to be, I saw Conjurer as the master of elements and that's why I got into this game. This patch has demoted them to master of heals, and if things don't change I'm going to be very disappointed with this game

Yeah man, exactly. Thinking of someone other than yourself. Not everyone is in a powerful ls, hell most of the lses are dying or dead. You have to think of people just starting out when you think about this mage problem, or this game doesn't stand a chance.

[Magiksmurf]

Awesome, the game finally gets a lil more challenging, now people will be able to separate the bad from the good players.
It's all about using tactics and not just rush head on onto every mob we encounter. =)

[Solfleur]

Yes, that's the issue in a nutshell. Thanks so much Neptune, you have mined the jewels from this thread and emphasized the very important point that not everyone a. can, due to a real life or b. ***gasp*** wants to play in a party, having been burned out by FFXI and the pervasive ingratitude, relative subjugation and disrespect shown toward healers when they are, in fact, the backbone of the game. The altruists will only continue in that kind of environment for so long and then we WILL demand more, and FFXIV not only led us to believe we were getting that "more"...they GAVE it to us and have now taken it away, and added insult to injury by calling it a GIFT. Yeah...it's made us a tad testy. Anyway thank you again Neptune; I wish you were on the Bodum server...I'd be honored to play with you. ^^ I know that didn't sound right...

[LuxLex]

yeah, I think there were plenty of ways for the devs to make the game more challenging then making mages feeble.

[SuMDRGMAN]

quit cryin mages ^^

[Solfleur]

How about we just quit healing and buffing you weapon swinging bozos? See who's "crying" then...^^

[LuxLex]

How about we just quit healing and buffing you weapon swinging bozos? See who's "crying" then...^^

See the "mage strike" thread.

[Oscillate_Wildly]

How about we just quit healing and buffing you weapon swinging bozos? See who's "crying" then...^^

I lol'd hard.
MAGE STRIKE~.
In all seriousness, you'll just end up getting scabs and the sort. In XI I too played a RDM/BLM as a main healer, and it was dull mind-wearing work. It was a lot of good practice and I admit with the current system we've been a little spoiled you have to admit. After all, as a rdm main healer, it wasn't just cures. It was hasting and refreshing nearly everyone in your party and managing your MP between fights and during fights. And God forbid you're late hasting someone as soon as it's worn off, then you'd end up getting an earful.

When Scholar came along it was the same thing. Thankless, tiring macro punching work to be able to play the way I did with a rdm sub. To say all mages in the history of the game are MP retardant, lazy EZmode bums, maybe you ought to look at yourselves. Mages are like the midwest of the USA, too kind to really say anything about your shit play styles as melee. Don't think we haven't noticed how often you miss with your WS's.

Anyhow. A lot has been broken that doesn't involve MP, and it's ridiculous. And if you're the ones saying we're whiny-crying babies I'm going to assume you're either spoiled by having someone back you up for heals, or you just haven't played a heal-slave as long as you say you have.

To deny this game is pigeon holing CON's as WHM's onry, you're deluded. With the advancements of jobs, this will only enforce the 'role' deeper. Let me remind you of XI's Scholar that had the capability to both heal and deal out damage. In situations where you weren't in a hardcore shell, and relied on pick-me-ups during the day before/after primetime, you were stuck main healing. Summoners? Main healers. Red mages? Main healers. None of these classes, when defined by set specific skills like Con has now (the only AoE cure), are going to be allowed the freedom to play as they choose. That's just being naive, as much as I'd like it to be true that just isn't the case anymore. Especially for soloers.

[Neptune]

Lovely, CON has been totally nerfed. Good from bad players...? BS. Granted, I do have to work around MS, which means some of the posts I have made on these boards are a bit retarded sounding in retrospect, but I don't have much of an emotional filter--I say what I feel in the heat of the moment. That said, and having given a good couple days of thought into this before posting...I still say CON has been totally effing NERFED. For once there was a magic user able to solo through a game without being USED and ABUSED by brainless weapon swingers (no I don't really feel that way, as I've played the warrior classes to endgame in FFXI and have several leveled to mid levels in this game) ...and SE IMMEDIATELY has to nerf the living hell out of us and make us dependent on the "protection" of the "party system" ...slaves to the collective, as usual. What an effing YAWN. I am SO glad I haven't paid a dime toward paying this game because they have now effectively ensured it will never be worth it. And to any "brilliant" persons who honestly think this total nerf fest separates good players from bad, I can only say I'm sorry you've missed your place in time. You'd have been happy slave holders in the American south. "Good" people of a "certain class" were forced into their "proper place" back then too! I cannot begin to express how offensive I found that comment. As a rdm in FFXI I was better than most whm's when drafted in a pinch to main heal and I subbed blm. I think I can play the game just fine, thank you. Nerfed is nerfed. It's insane to be unable to get through a 30 leve at rank 31 with good gear using all possible magic conserving spells without running out of mp 3/4 of the way through the fight. THIS NEEDS FIXED NOW!

Totally agree with you. Thanks for posting. I played RDM/BLM too.. I think anyone that DID play RDM in XI felt the relief of CON.. an active playstyle full of diversity and usefulness, freed from the brainless monotony of Refresh and Haste whore.

[Solfleur]

Sad but true. I was having a blast playing solo. My odd schedule makes playing solo a must, and to be honest I prefer playing as a CON and I do NOT like party play because of the thanklessness of it all. The superior attitude of the mallet-heads just tees me off too much...and given I practice the healing arts in real life...well it would just be "take care of me but don't expect my pay or gratitude" overload. One can only be "so" nice in life. I was having fun nuking the hell out of things and taking care of myself and not needing some meat headed "protector" who expected me to "lift my tail" for him...ahem...when play time got slow. It all just gets so old.... Even when you tell people you're a fifty something year old grandma they don't care... What's a woman/magic user to do?