Current State of End-Game Contents - A Blog Post from A Japanese Player

[Pibz]

You're horribly missing his point here. People enjoy the story. Coil has a story. People should enjoy Coil. Sad thing is, they don't. For various reasons, one of them being they may get instant-killed at every step they attempt.

As i said earlier in this thread, i think they should indeed make a easier version of coil(and in turn give us a harder version of ct too) for those only interested in lore.

First, you don't need a perfect rotation to succeed in coil. You need a basic damage output (basic here is adaptable to the fight, of course it isn't spamming 1-2-3-repeat) and you're good.
Second, the actual choregraphy for each fight does let you perform a high enough dps to do anything you'd want to achieve so hmmm, knowing said dance isn't really more a test of skill then spamming combos. It is indeed harder, but only requires more memory, not more skill.
Lastly, since when having a fight "not relying ONLY on mechanics" is a synonym of "having a dummy fight" ? Stop thinking "black or white". Maybe end game content could just stop spamming one shot mechanics every time and just focus on a few of them ?

1- You probably never did the fights undergeared or with just barely enough gear so you never experienced the difference between barely making the top dps you can and not doing it. This was the reason why, when it was released, some people had more trouble passing the dps checks in T4 than others for example(or in any fight that has dps checks really).

2- LOL so moving away from the boss interrupting your cast or simply putting you out of range or simply busying you with just doing something else doesn't influece dps? mmkay then

3 - Fights don't rely only on mechanics, gear matters and so does individual skill i'm tired of repeating this.

And lastly STOP talking about encounters you haven't even tried ffs.

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Sigh
Answer me this, why do people who have experience in other MMOs and other games, find mechanics like landslide trivial(from the first few times, not after hours upon hours) more often than those that don't have experience?
Please go ahead and twist logic to evade the definition of skill.
Also, since when is being able to execute a set of actions (be they patterned or not) not a skill?

So you finally beat Turn 5 - you never die to divebomb/twisters anymore! - good job!... did you gain any "skills" from doing this that apply to any other game, or even to any other fight in FFXIV itself?

Yes, you've learned how to dodge crap, congrats.
Oh, and if you did it while there was no echo well let's see some examples:
As a healer you might have learned how to time your shield so that it is applied right before a big attack.
As a tank you might've learned how to properly set up a cooldown rotation.
As a dps you might've learned to save your cooldowns for when a burst is really needed.
This is just off the top of my head, sure some might've had those skills before, but then it'd have been easier for them too.

[zPanda]

As a healer you might have learned how to time your shield so that it is applied right before a big attack.
As a tank you might've learned how to properly set up a cooldown rotation.
As a dps you might've learned to save your cooldowns for when a burst is really needed.
This is just off the top of my head, sure you might've had those skills before, but you might've learned them too.

People can and have used macros and apps to assist with all this stuff. MMORPG often rely on mechanics rather than skill which is why it's possible to implement and use these types of "assists". Also you basically prove my point lol. How do you know *when* to those big attacks are coming or when a burst is needed? - it's because you've repeated a fight enough to know the patterns.

It would be really interesting to get one group of 8 "hardcore" players, and another group of 8 "mainstream" players, and when 2.3 is released, have a real-time stream of the 2 parties in Ramuh-EX practicing to defeat it with no external apps or voice-chat. I would bet the amount of time required for each party to defeat it would be close to the same.

There's nothing like "twintania tracker" or ffxiv-app that will help increase your "skill" in those other game genres I mentioned previously that require real skill.

[Pibz]

People can and have used macros and apps to assist with all this stuff. MMORPG often rely on mechanics rather than skill which is why it's possible to implement and use these types of "assists". Also you basically prove my point lol. How do you know *when* to those big attacks are coming or when a burst is needed? - it's because you've repeated a fight enough to know the patterns.

There's nothing like "twintania tracker" or ffxiv-app that will help increase your "skill" in those other game genres I mentioned previously that require real skill.

*MEGA SIGH*
There's no point, i'm talking to a wall.
The answer is in my previous post.

It would be really interesting to get one group of 8 "hardcore" players, and another group of 8 "mainstream" players, and when 2.3 is released, have a real-time stream of the 2 parties in Ramuh-EX practicing to defeat it with no external apps or voice-chat. I would bet the amount of time required for each party to defeat it would be close to the same.

Oh dear... it's worse than i thought, you have no clue..
So you think there's some guides and magic apps from the heavens that the people that do the 1st kills receive?
You do realize the strats this people come up with take a few hours of pulling and dying to develop right?
Is there also no skill in being the first to nail down the winning strat? Ok, go do it then.

[zPanda]

It would be really interesting to get one group of 8 "hardcore" players, and another group of 8 "mainstream" players, and when 2.3 is released, have a real-time stream of the 2 parties in Ramuh-EX practicing to defeat it with no external apps or voice-chat. I would bet the amount of time required for each party to defeat it would be close to the same.

Going back to an earlier point here - if it was possible to set this up, would you bet your house on the "hardcore" group beating a brand new battle faster than the "mainstream" group? I know I wouldn't lol.

On the other hand, if you set up a fight between one of the top Street Fighter players in the world versus a random decent player, would I bet my house on the top SF player? Yeah, you bet I would.

[Pibz]

Going back to an earlier point here - if it was possible to set this up, would you bet your house on the "hardcore" group beating a brand new battle faster than the "mainstream" group? I know I wouldn't lol.

On the other hand, if you set up a fight between one of the top Street Fighter players in the world versus a random decent player, would I bet my house on the top SF player? Yeah, you bet I would.

Would i bet on the people that clear the content first, over people who have trouble dodging trivial mechanics? Yes, yes i would.

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No point arguing semantics, of what skill means, if some people can do it and others can't there's something there, and let me tell you, it's far from being just lag in 90%+ of the cases(lots of times with randoms on a lot of encounters has shown me this)..
Also this is the last answer you'll get from me, you people refuse to concede on anything, you just want your tank and spank fights, it's pointless.

[zPanda]

Would i bet on the people that clear the content first, over people who have trouble dodging trivial mechanics? Yes, yes i would .

Lol let's be real here. Is "dodging" in this game really about "skill" , or more about repeating the fights enough to basically know when the attacks are coming. Look at some of the previous threads regarding titan-ex for example - people deal with lag by simply memorizing when attacks are coming out and "dodging" ahead of time.

Also, again, T6 was much easier to clear IMO than T5. So why do I see so many people still struggling with the basic parts of that fight like devour? If this game is truly skill-based, shouldn't anyone who's cleared T5 find T6 a cakewalk?

[Pibz]

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People who beat T5 before 2.2, had very little difficulty, in general, in beating T6 in comparison to the time it took them to beat T5, so your point isn't even true.
This is also my last reply to you, since you also just repeat your points over and over regardless of what is said, but if you think MMO's(you clearly omited the genre in your "genre that require skill" list) are so dumb easy and uninteresting what are you doing here?

Also LOL on your music example. Not even going to comment on that one.

[Pibz]

I'm really interested about what you consider being "skill".

From wikipedia: "A skill is the learned ability to carry out a task with pre-determined results often within a given amount of time, energy, or both"
Can you carry out the task of finishing a fight without dying? Then you are skilled enough in the fight(regardless of how little importance you give to that skill, or how little of a x measurable trait you need possess to do it) to beat it, you can't do it? You are not.
Now with a logic sequence of thought prove this is breaking the definition of skill. Have fun, im going to play the game now.