Current State of End-Game Contents - A Blog Post from A Japanese Player

[IgnisFatuus]

a lot of the art assets are ripped right out of 1.0, including "recent" content. i expect a drop of "new content" once they run out of stuff to reimplement. but that might actually be when the expansion hits.

[ZephyrAM]

Not true...
mechanic changed, but not much...
Titan and Leviathan already were finished but not released, Shiva and Ramuh were work in progress...

2.x is currently not even finished with "recoloring" 1.x content

The 'only' thing that really matters here is the programming. ARR changed entirely in that regard, and it doesn't matter in the slightest how much of the conceptual game transferred from 1.0, because it all had to be recreated from the ground up, which takes time, testing, and implementation. They can't actually 'use' any of the resources from 1.0 anymore then they could pull premade resources from XI.

So as much as we'd like to think of 2.0 as just an expansion of 1.0, technology just doesn't work that way.

[Lemon8or]

I don't know anyone in my LS/FC who is actually bored or out of content. We run the endgame stuff at our pace statically, but the rest of the time we collect tomestones, atmas, books, sightseeing, RP, leveling alt jobs, crafting, gathering, gardening or pickup EX, HM's, BC. I don't know, I find all of that stuff very fun to do, but I can understand why others don't.

I happen to be one of those people that is getting bored actually. Besides turn 9, there's nothing that I can work on for this patch, well good thing 2.3 is coming but not many stuffs there neither. Tomestones? 1 expert roulette per day. Atmas? Books? Meh when I can have a legitimate shot at HA weapons. It's a boring grind. RP? Not my cup of tea. Leveling alt jobs? Crafting? Gathering? Look at my signature. EX? Cleared all, have everything from them except the Garuda/Titan/Ifrit ponies but farming parties for these EX fights usually fail so yeah.... A large number of people in my FC is growing bored as well and haven't logged in for days on end while we used to log in everyday with things to do.

[Rosy]

snip.

This is my first FF game....but have played mmos since UO and it's the first time I've ever come across "statics"...we are used to guilds and doing things with the guild (FC in this game), not having to find outsiders who we may or may not particularly like, to do content.

[Kiara]

I'm not sure I understand why people are against being in or finding a static.

I myself have a static, but I'm speaking for many friends that I know (and the one who's quitting) as well as FC mates who don't have statics. I'm glad you have found 7 other people who work w/ your schedule and can do things successfully together as a static.

Please just know that not everyone can do that. Whether it's inconsistent schedules (work, school, family), merging with 7 *other* people's schedules to find matching times, to then finding 7 other people who also can memorize the gimmicks as well as you can (and vice versa), to people quitting, or in finals, etc., not everyone is as fortunate to have 8 people all raiding and executing successfully at the same time each week.

One of the issues mentioned throughout this thread is that fundamental fact: That when you do party with players whom you don't know (DF / PF, temporary reps, helping FC / LS mates out, newbies) the way these fights are set up are not conducive to mistakes. It's so punitive in this way that it has a high chance of bringing down the entire raid party when someone makes a mistake (or you end up with not enough DPS to clear key stages which also leads to a fail).

Again, I have nothing against statics personally (I've had good statics since 1.0), but I see so many friends, FC/LS mates who struggle and who don't want to get in one for various reason, or can't get a consistent one to work. There are many factors at work here that might be "easy" for you, but not for many players. Thanks.

[Melithea]

I happen to be one of those people that is getting bored actually.

You only have 2650 achievement points. That alone tells me that there is a lot that you COULD do. You just choose not to because it doesn't seem to interest you. From the sound of it, that's because none of it appeals to your sense of "progression". And as I said before, there's nothing wrong with that.

But this is a completely different problem than "Second Coil needs to be fixed because less than 100% of players can beat it." Second Coil adds 3 hours of content per week for people who can clear it, so if everyone was clearing it they would still be bored. This is a distraction from the point of the thread and should not be confused with the idea that Second Coil is designed badly because it requires people to pay attention and deal with interesting challenges. I brought up the overall lack of content to SHOW that it was a separate issue, not to derail the thread and make it the main topic. Making Coil accessible to everyone will not solve the late-patch cycle doldrums.

[Clavaat]

Please just know that not everyone can do that. Whether it's inconsistent schedules (work, school, family), merging with 7 *other* people's schedules to find matching times, to then finding 7 other people who also can memorize the gimmicks as well as you can (and vice versa), to people quitting, or in finals, etc., not everyone is as fortunate to have 8 people all raiding and executing successfully at the same time each week.

Thanks for the reply! I sort of went over this in another reply to someone else, but as far as scheduling is concerned, my goal has always been to find the best time for us. This doesn't mean perfect, as in we sometimes have to do fill-ins, but it doesn't prevent us from still trying that night. It is certainly difficult to find that sweet spot, but I think it's very possible. My LS currently has 3 statics, all at different points and paces with different schedules. I encourage people all the time to make one, with me assisting in the recruitment department to get everyone gathered. It requires some external work, but the result is really nice. Even though I've had some friends split from our static to run another, it's only helped us grow and make new friends. We also make it so you are not limited to your static and your static only by any means.

One of the issues mentioned throughout this thread is that fundamental fact: That when you do party with players whom you don't know (DF / PF, temporary reps, helping FC / LS mates out, newbies) the way these fights are set up are not conducive to mistakes. It's so punitive in this way that it has a high chance of bringing down the entire raid party when someone makes a mistake (or you end up with not enough DPS to clear key stages which also leads to a fail).

This I do agree with to some extent. The fact, that is. But can making mistakes or learning from mistakes be fun? To me, yes, it definitely can be. I'm not one to give up on people; I have never truly felt, "There is no way we are going to clear this ever." I'm sure that sounds silly, but seriously. I've had people who don't share that mentality and have left, but the people who stay will clear it eventually. And the feeling of completing after trying for a long time is a thousand times more satisfying

I think banking on the impatience of others will be something that will be ironed out over time. New content will be released, new players will still come on, older content will be made easier one way or another. It seems as though the dev team is already pushing toward more "horizontal" options, thus spreading people out to other things as opposed to keeping us all locked on "you must do BC, you must do EX, etc." I know it's already spawned the whole "Well how long is too long to wait?!" debate, but that's just personal opinion and very irrelevant.

[Lemon8or]

You only have 2650 achievement points. That alone tells me that there is a lot that you COULD do. You just choose not to because it doesn't seem to interest you. From the sound of it, that's because none of it appeals to your sense of "progression". And as I said before, there's nothing wrong with that.

I was and never have been a completionist, more of a minimalist, so achievement points mean nothing to me. I do things that I feel as you say it "gives me a sense of progression", whether by playing different jobs so I understand what my group can do or progression on second coil. Grinding on 1 map to another to get a vanity tool or title is not what I think of as progression and this game has a lot of those side-tracking achievements but I was never big on aesthetic things, only when it stands out really badly like the monk boots I have. Different people have different taste as to what appeals to them so I was only speaking for myself and the people I know.
If you actually take a look at my achievements instead of a generic points system, you'll see that battle-wise, I have cleared everything up to turn 8 and relic every single job. The only thing I left out is animus/novus/vanity/chocobo achievements. Why? Because they are grindy and not fun. Crafting and gathering-wise, I have every single one of them at 50 and right where they need to be: being able to craft and gather things I need.
On topic, why not just make the boss simply strong? Because imo that is boring. There is one thing and one thing only that you're dealing with, the damage they deal. RPGs are fun because there are multiple scenarios you have to anticipate for. If wasn't for that, I would play generic FPS where the only thing that matters is seeing an enemy first and kill him instead.

[Zantetsuken]

People want challenge... they just want it to be less like this:









And more like this:




...or this:





...or even this:





For all the modern technology showcased in ARR, why there is virtually ZERO A.I. in endgame boss battles?


BTW Extra Credits "Easy Games" episode is far more accurate in describing this problem.

The takeaway part is:

People want challenges based on DEPTH, rather than challenge based on EXECUTION

ARR's endgame challenges are based almost entirely on EXECUTION. And not just your own EXECUTION, but everyone else's as well. This is mind-numbingly boring when done correctly, and insanely frustrating when you wipe for the XXth time with a PUG.

Combine it with a linear gear system that makes any reward for your work meaningless after a few months, and you will understand why ARR has alienated long-time MMO players.

[Iriadysa]

People want challenge... they just want it to be less like this:

For all the modern technology showcased in ARR, why there is virtually ZERO A.I. in endgame boss battles?

I don't think you are understanding this thread.

It's not that I don't agree with you. I would rather have a freakishly difficult game with really tough A.I.

This is not what the OP is asking for, however. What the OP is asking for is:


"I want this, but if I don't want to have to react so fast to dodge because I lag, so I want to be able to dodge with a 400ms connection"


"I want this, but my connection isn't good so it has to be lag independent!* And if I get hit, I want it to not be fatal so that I can recover!"
*Note: this is impossible.


"I want this, but I want gear to allow me to survive the hits if my gear is good enough!"

And so on and so forth.

Everything you showcased would require reflexes and latency way beyond what Titan Extreme or Twintania ask for.

So, again, it's not that I don't agree with you, it's that this isn't really what the OP and the horde of goons is asking for.

EDIT: The FFXI examples, however, is what they want. 100% gear carried encounters. Unless you count the whole "OMG RUN OUT OF THE ROOM" thing in Ultima. Then it's 90%.

ARR's endgame challenges are based almost entirely on EXECUTION. And not just your own EXECUTION, but everyone else's as well. This is mind-numbingly boring when done correctly, and insanely frustrating when you wipe for the XXth time with a PUG.

Combine it with a linear gear system that makes any reward for your work meaningless after a few months, and you will understand why ARR has alienated long-time MMO players.

Yes they are, and it's a problem.

But can you explain what depth is there in any of those two FFXI encounters you linked?

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Let me put it this way: anyone that looks at your first images (not the FFXI ones) and says "Yes I want this!" and then says "They should make Titan Extreme less lag dependent!" is a massive hypocrite. Or an idiot. Probably both.