Almost everyone wants to "skip" having to raid!

[Cherie]

Can your really say that raids in pick up groups always go very well? I often get trolled by people. Sometimes the trolls will just repeatedly try to wipe groups on purpose or will wear inappropriate gear (not even talking about being not geared, talking about wearing a snowman suit when they are the main tank). At least, when I frequent groups with guildmates, they know not to be a total jerk, or odds are, we could take some other person for the next one.

Sure, some pugs go well though, it's always a random thing because there is no accountability. You will never see them again most likely, so people have the sign to act like a total jerk. :P

Not sure I understand anyone's aversion to being in a "static", but I know it's something many don't want and I accept it. Personally I just wonder if it's just this game, or games in general now. When I most recently played Rift for instance, while there were many pug raids, most people always were cheerful about having their static that could get further because they practiced hard and figured it out. There were many alts (I had like 2 or 3 myself) and I would frequently pug raids on my alts and have lots of fun, even occasionally get to the last boss (but not often).

[Skull_Angel]

Not sure I understand anyone's aversion to being in a "static", but I know it's something many don't want and I accept it. Personally I just wonder if it's just this game, or games in general now. When I most recently played Rift for instance, while there were many pug raids, most people always were cheerful about having their static that could get further because they practiced hard and figured it out. There were many alts (I had like 2 or 3 myself) and I would frequently pug raids on my alts and have lots of fun, even occasionally get to the last boss (but not often).

There's not real aversion to being in a static, but it's not always possible to jump up and say "hey, I'm board and have enough time, lest run a raid!". This is the kind of situation many people are faced with that have work schedules that often change weekly. Most of the time I can get several people together for whatever whenever, but finding a full party of buddies to run any time rarely happens.

[Corfish]

snip

Oh, don't get me wrong. I understand why statics exist, and I know just how horribly wrong PUGs can go. And I would honestly LOVE to move on and tackle the hardest content possible, but I find it difficult because of the need for a static. I don't mind having 1 or 2 friends I run a lot with, but I don't like being forced to stop and say "Nope, can't run this because I have to run it with this group later." It's just really unappealing to me. I've never played an MMO where I've been told I can only run this dungeon once a week (as you may have guessed, I haven't played a large amount :P), and it's actually a hard concept for me to wrap my head around. I understand why they do it, I just think it's odd that SE has to police the new content to make sure people don't burn themselves out on it.

On alts, I would have an alt if I got some kind of benefit from it. If I were to make an alt now, I would honestly probably make one purely for roleplay purposes (not something I do, but it's the only reason I could see making one.) I have access to all the classes on one character, I find the level grind to be the most annoying part of MMOs, I don't want to do it with more than one character just to be able to run locked content more than once a week.

I would love to run the newest content as soon as it's out, but statics just don't fit me. Getting a couple of friends or FC members together to run content on the other hand does. But with weekly lockouts, that just isn't going to happen.

Have you looked into other servers? I'm sure some servers are more dedicated to raiding than others. I've heard rumors Siren is one that is, but honestly I wouldn't know since I'm not into that scene :P

[Yurimi]

Having played MMO's since they were something you did on a BBS over telnet (dont judge me) I agree that raiding these days seems to take a back burner where people want the best gear from killing the same thing 300 times. Not sure when this changed I remember when people were ok with getting good loot from mundane tasks while the great loot was reserved for those epic fights. For me I dont raid much anymore, to me its simply a matter of not having the drive I did back then. But I dont care that the best loot comes from coil while I simply have access to good loot. People need a reason to run this stuff otherwise it would simply be a matter of logging in running the same dungoen 10x logging out for the week and honestly... that sounds like the lamest game ever... how could you even try to sell that..

(D)EV: "So we are making an MMO..."
(P)ublisher "Ok what are your ideas"
(D): OK we got this dungeon with 3 bosses takes 15mins you run it 10x then you buy an item
(P): and what do you use this gear for
(D): to run the dungeon again
(P): OK and then what
(D): oh.. you want more? uhhh you log in the next week and do the same
(P): so there is nothing hard
(D): nah people dont want that
(P): then why gear, why play at all
(D): because.... dungeons !
(P): why would someone pay money every month to play with that
(D): because dungeons !
(P): not seeing a point to this
(D): people will trust me
(P): Get out
(D): ok sorry

[Malamasala]

...

I also have a hard time to understand how they think, and how it actually works.

(D) Let's make a dungeon that give you strong equipment.
(P) And what happens when you have collected them?
(D) You do the same dungeon again, but it is easier.
(P) So it is only hard first, and then it gets easy and boring?
(D) Err, yea.
(P) So people who think it is hard will quit instantly, and people who beat it will quit when it gets too easy?
(D) Exactly!

[Lunavi]

Having played MMO's since they were something you did on a BBS over telnet (dont judge me) I agree that raiding these days seems to take a back burner where people want the best gear from killing the same thing 300 times. Not sure when this changed I remember when people were ok with getting good loot from mundane tasks while the great loot was reserved for those epic fights. For me I dont raid much anymore, to me its simply a matter of not having the drive I did back then. But I dont care that the best loot comes from coil while I simply have access to good loot. People need a reason to run this stuff otherwise it would simply be a matter of logging in running the same dungoen 10x logging out for the week and honestly... that sounds like the lamest game ever... how could you even try to sell that..

(D)EV: "So we are making an MMO..."
(P)ublisher "Ok what are your ideas"
(D): OK we got this dungeon with 3 bosses takes 15mins you run it 10x then you buy an item
(P): and what do you use this gear for
(D): to run the dungeon again
(P): OK and then what
(D): oh.. you want more? uhhh you log in the next week and do the same
(P): so there is nothing hard
(D): nah people dont want that
(P): then why gear, why play at all
(D): because.... dungeons !
(P): why would someone pay money every month to play with that
(D): because dungeons !
(P): not seeing a point to this
(D): people will trust me
(P): Get out
(D): ok sorry

The reason behind that for me is due to the simple fact that the MMO community have changed. It is no longer people who look for a fun time with other people, it is people who want to show of their e-peen. And how do they do that? Well, by excluding other whose e-peens are not as long as theirs. It would be one thing not having SCoB gear if it did not mean that I would get locked out from doing any kind of content but sadly with the modern MMO community it does. Look at WoW for example: To run the raid mode where the highest end loot drop you almost already have to have the loot in question to get into the groups. That is the issue. I have no problem with people having to fight for gear, but when not having it means being excluded from doing the content in itself something is really wrong.

I am not saying that this game is that bad yet, but I want to empatize the YET in that statement.

[Cherie]

The reason behind that for me is due to the simple fact that the MMO community have changed. It is no longer people who look for a fun time with other people, it is people who want to show of their e-peen. And how do they do that? Well, by excluding other whose e-peens are not as long as theirs. It would be one thing not having SCoB gear if it did not mean that I would get locked out from doing any kind of content but sadly with the modern MMO community it does. Look at WoW for example: To run the raid mode where the highest end loot drop you almost already have to have the loot in question to get into the groups. That is the issue. I have no problem with people having to fight for gear, but when not having it means being excluded from doing the content in itself something is really wrong.

I am not saying that this game is that bad yet, but I want to empatize the YET in that statement.

Was there a time when it was different? It's been that way for a really long time... Elitism in games is nothing new, people did that when WoW was first released really. The only MMO game I played where no one cared about gear was City of Heroes but that was because there was no gear to get.

[Luxx]

Lock out of Coil 2 will probably be removed once Coil 3 is out.

[Kinseykinz]

Lock out of Coil 2 will probably be removed once Coil 3 is out.

Yeah, but if coil 1 is any indicator, they will ALSO nerf Coil 2 at this point....which while maybe some folk enjoy, kinda still ruins the fun for others.

Hell my original BC coil static fell apart because half of us wanted to beat T5 pre-nerf and the other half 'why waste our time now, we'll just beat at nerf, farm it and move on'

For people who like including others, striving to be their best, but progressing at a steady pace with friends, this current system is poo.

If they changed nothing else other than 'locking' you from being able to lot gear in the 2nd coil once you 'cleared' that turn for the week, they would ease up restrictions enough for most FC's to be able to help each other out more....instead of the 'too bad for you 5 who didn't make it in the static, guess you'll have to pug it/wait until you find people to run with'.

[Logistical]

Yeah, but if coil 1 is any indicator, they will ALSO nerf Coil 2 at this point....which while maybe some folk enjoy, kinda still ruins the fun for others.

Without this coming off elitist. This is nobodies fault. Make a static around times that work for you, or in the long run you have to deal. Coil 2 will end up being nerfed more than likely; and while I have plenty of friends that see it this was as well, none of them have honestly complained. They get up and try again, and push themselves to be better.


I work graveyard shift on a PST based server. I made a static that works around my times, with a group of 7 of my friends. 4 of which started out as total strangers to me.

Hell my original BC coil static fell apart because half of us wanted to beat T5 pre-nerf and the other half 'why waste our time now, we'll just beat at nerf, farm it and move on'

Tbh in a game, with logic like that. I would avoid them because that takes all the fun out of it. If you don't want a challenge raiding isn't for you.

For people who like including others, striving to be their best, but progressing at a steady pace with friends, this current system is poo.

My group strives to be their best. Progress at a steady pace only 2 nights a week. 2-3 Hours a night [Changes if IRL happens, and it does]. We cleared it out and now spend 2 hours a week clearing out coil. Getting faster with gear.

If they changed nothing else other than 'locking' you from being able to lot gear in the 2nd coil once you 'cleared' that turn for the week, they would ease up restrictions enough for most FC's to be able to help each other out more....instead of the 'too bad for you 5 who didn't make it in the static, guess you'll have to pug it/wait until you find people to run with'.

A real FC would take those 5 people and recruit to help them make a static, not tell them pug it or gl hope you find a group to run with.
The lock out thing won't happen. It will take away from the one aspect of raiding that a lot of people disregard and that's the competition. It seems petty to some, but it is a thing.


I understand some people don't want to be 'bound' by a time. I understand some people want to be spontaneous and do their own thing when they want, but I don't feel a change will be coming anytime soon.