When to use Flare?

[MicahZerrshia]

or continue to be stubborn. Your call.

Hi pot my name's kettle lol

idk how you can get so many flares off in brayflox, with 2 decently geared blm you can do f3 > f2 > f2 > f2 > sc flare > done. If there is a mob left with a few hp just scathe and be done. If you are getting 4-7 flares off in one rotation in bf hm your dps is in the toilet anyway.

I think this is just one of those situations where you just walk away cause there aint no way someone will admit there are superior or even relatively close methods they don't approve of that exist anyway. Its called a troll and you need to stop feeding it.

[NoctisUmbra]

idk how you can get so many flares off in brayflox, with 2 decently geared blm you can do f3 > f2 > f2 > f2 > sc flare > done. If there is a mob left with a few hp just scathe and be done. If you are getting 4-7 flares off in one rotation in bf hm your dps is in the toilet anyway.

With 2 decently geared BLM, the mobs would die to the initial double Flares with Convert to begin with, or be left with minimal HP.

Honestly now, if the only argument against the Flare only rotation is "shit is dying too fast in this dungeon I'm overgeared for" then by all means, do what you like. Obviously it makes no difference in that scenario.

Go into Brayflox on DF and get a MNk who also plays bad as the only other DPS in party. Then go ahead and try your Fire II rotation on one pack and the Flare only rotation on the other. Then you'll see what I'm talking about.

[Maero]

Well if all you have been doing is testing on dummies, well ok
Again were did i say i double flare? I turned the "pretty widely" accepted 2x flares into 3x flares
My rotation is that of those who have used parsers, not test dummies
Yes when i first reached 50 blm i used your rotation but only after countless testing, mostly by others but i have and continue to test different rotations
have i realized there is more dps to be had.
Also several mobs or more, overtime Fire 2's will in fact add up and will be more dmg
Anyhow, best of luck in coil

/closethread

[NoctisUmbra]

Well if all you have been doing is testing on dummies, well ok

My testing is not exclusive to dummies. That would be silly. They have their place, and provide conclusions in a certain context.

More relevant testing is content like Turn 4 of BCoB or Brayflox (Hard) speed runs.

Again were did i say i double flare? I turned the "pretty widely" accepted 2x flares into 3x flares

I'm still not sure you understand what I'm comparing. The opener is not in question here. Everyone worth their salt will open an AoE burn with

Fire III > Flare > Convert > Flare (> Ether > Flare) > Transpose

You didn't turn anything into anything. Not sure if English isn't your first language or not, but when I say double Flare rotation I haven't been referring to starting off with 2 Flares.

The comparison here is, what do you do after that opener, when you've use up your Convert and Ether?

A. Transpose > Blizzard (I/II/III) > Fire III > Fire II > Fire II > Fire II > Transpose > etc.

or

B. Transpose > {wait} > Flare > Flare > Transpose > etc.


Comparing those 2 extensions to the AoE burn rotation, B comes out far ahead. It's not even close.

/closethread

Whatever you say, buddy. Pretty sure the thread doesn't close when you want it to though.

[NyneAlexander]

i have yet to do extensive testing of either, as i've just begun to master the cold flare/hot flare rotation. But every time i've tried to do it in a real world setting (brayflox HM) stuff has died too fast for me to get to the 4th flare. Not necessarily because of my DPS, but because of the other DPS/WHM holys doing their thing too. And all of my recent T4 farms have been with 5 dps and 1 healer. I need to find some sucky DPS to run with so I can have enough time to properly test this rotation in real life.

[NoctisUmbra]

Shit dying too fast sounds like a good problem to have.

[Ringabell]

I've seen comments like the one in bold said numerous times. Along with other things like people counting the 2 seconds in their head. Are people guessing or using an internal clock? Are people unaware that you can just use the umbral ice buff timer to see your 2 second wait time? i.e. You get your tick at 8 seconds on your UI buff, you would start your cast at 6 seconds on your UI buff.

Just throwing it out there because i've seen enough people say things that lead me to believe they are kind of guessing at the 2 second window when the game gives you its own timer to use.

I feel like a total n00b now. Where is the timer?

[silvio]

I feel like a total n00b now. Where is the timer?

the timer is where your buffs are. when you are in umbral ice or astral fire, you will have a timer for how long you stay in either. the timer refreshes when you cast another ice/fire spell to keep the stacks up.

the key to using flare after transpose is waiting for your first mana tick which varies depending on where you are in the server clock. im guessing, instead of counting 2 seconds in your head, he's suggesting you look at your UI timer and use that to count 2 seconds after you get your first mana tick. good idea.

[NyneAlexander]

after a weekend worth of testing in various dungeons, its safe to say that infinite flare > any other AoE rotation, EXCEPT when raging strikes is up. So use FIII, F2, Ranging strikes, F2, F2, Flare, convert, swift flare. After that Fire III, infinite flare, until you have raging strikes up again.

[Darske]

Is your mana really low, like around 250 but you have swiftcast up? Swiftcast flare!

Is your mana really low and you don't have swiftcast up? Might as well flare!

No more enemies? No need to AOE? No problem, it's time to flare!

Full Limit Gauge? Flare x Meteor 2x sick combo!

In short, my protip for black mage: is it blowing up? If no, blow it up. If yes, blow it up harder!