DPS Tool

[Alukah]

Seems more like a plague of carebears to be honest.

If I was under performing I'd want to know about it, so that I could try and improve, not have it hidden from me in case it hurts my feelings lol.

If you enjoy being insulted then good for you.

With this playerbase, a tool like that would hardly be used for constructive criticism.

[Esmian]

If you enjoy being insulted then good for you.

With this playerbase, a tool like that would hardly be used for constructive criticism.

I'm honestly at a loss for what kind of player base wouldn't have people reacting negatively if they knew people were under performing by a large degree.

[Alukah]

I'm honestly at a loss for what kind of player base wouldn't have people reacting negatively if they knew people were under performing by a large degree.

Are you asking how many of us would insult someone else for having low damage instead of giving advice?

[Esmian]

Are you asking how many of us would insult someone else for having low damage instead of giving advice?

Well I fail to see how people who say give advice don't realize that when they give advice they're vocally acknowledging that the person in question is under performing by whatever standards they've set and that they should accept the advice(whether helpful or not) to meet your expectations of how they should be playing. Whether you think you're being nice about it or not both methods are effectively criticizing how that person is playing the game by your own standards.

[skaterger]

Well I fail to see how people who say give advice don't realize that when they give advice they're vocally acknowledging that the person in question is under performing by whatever standards they've set and that they should accept the advice(whether helpful or not) to meet your expectations of how they should be playing. Whether you think you're being nice about it or not both methods are effectively criticizing how that person is playing the game by your own standards.

Are you seriously implying that giving advice is the same as criticising or insulting? Compare these two statements and tell me if they're the same.

"Hey baning the spumes to the head/tail can increase your dps"

"Omg why didn't you cast bane on the spumes you noob? L2P."


Unless you tell me you have no desire to improve whatsoever as a player I fail to see your point.

[Esmian]

snip.

In both cases you're singling out the SMN's dps not being up to par if the party isn't meeting a dps check for the encounter. And my point was that keeping parsers out of the game is pointless because regardless of the tone of the person there will always be player opinion of how much dps each class can do in a fight(unless you're telling players not to have an opinion), particularly with this game due to the many dps checks that exist. The only thing "official" parsers will do is help pinpoint where people can improve and reduce baseless criticisms because dps information would be readily available for everyone to see.

[skaterger]

snip

Singling out would imply I have a personal vendetta against that particular player. All I'm saying is that I don't see anything wrong with giving players advice so long as it's not done in a condescending manner, all the more if we are not meeting dps checks. How the other party chooses to interpret it is up to them.

And by offering suggestions does not implicitly mean they are a bad player. Take T8 for example. I usually do around 320 dps for that fight but I felt it could be higher. So I talked to a smn that cleared t9 and he advised me that auto attacking gave about 10-15 over the course of the fight. Guess what I tried it and it worked

Personally I feel what is holding many players back is how sensitive they take every piece of advice as an insult or criticism. I'm sure most of the top players weren't born with it naturally and also learnt from others and guides.

[Alukah]

There is a difference between telling someone their damage is lower than it should be and insulting them.

There is already a report function/blist if people were being rude.

There is a difference between how things should work and how they actually do.

On paper any issue caused by a tool like this can be controlled, but the practice tells otherwise.

SE peeps don't want to lose or ban elitists, but they don't want to lose casuals either.

The problem with this playerbase is that it's extremely low-skill and carebear, not that it's "elitist".

I'm not sure if we're talking about the same game here.

Well I fail to see how people who say give advice don't realize that when they give advice they're vocally acknowledging that the person in question is under performing by whatever standards they've set and that they should accept the advice(whether helpful or not) to meet your expectations of how they should be playing. Whether you think you're being nice about it or not both methods are effectively criticizing how that person is playing the game by your own standards.

But I never said giving criticism about under performing is wrong, whether you're being constructive or destructive is what matters here. A tool like this immensely helps with the first, but they cannot simply ignore the second when that could cause them a loss of players.

[Raenryong]

If you enjoy being insulted then good for you.

With this playerbase, a tool like that would hardly be used for constructive criticism.

The problem with this playerbase is that it's extremely low-skill and carebear, not that it's "elitist".

@Gormogon: as always, you are making huge assumptions. Ignoring all of those, in your case where people complain when people with lower ilevel gear join your party - what is a better test of skill, a dps meter (which shows output) or just a base ilevel check (which, as I'm sure everyone agrees, does not represent skill)? People will stop complaining about that ilevel70 BLM who is in your speedrun when it turns out that s/he is doing 600+ dps.