Time limit to re-enter dungeons

[Kiara]

Hi All,

While the 5 Minute (basically non-existent) restriction to re-enter Dungeon might be super convenient and helpful to cater to anyone playing the game, there is one aspect that FF XIV is suffering from as a result of this type of convenience:

* Lack of Feeling of Genuine, Major Accomplishment.

By this I mean the feeling you get for accomplishing something that made you get up and shout in elation and relief over defeating / overcoming / gaining something that was rare.

The last batch of 20 Mid-Level NMs are a perfect example of what Richard and some others are talking about:

* After the initial buzz of maybe 2 or 3 days (if that), no one really cares about those 20 NMs any more.

The Drops don't feel special at all. There is no great sense of accomplishment for getting a drop from an NM that respawns within 1 minute to 5 minutes of being killed (with a decent drop rate).

Now, on the other hand, it *is* very convenient and allowed pretty much everyone that put a little bit of effort into it, to gain their very own Unique / Untradeable NM Weapon / Armor. So that's great for everyone just wanting to get an item to use (which has also hurt the crafters for items in that range (since many people with means can just hunt the NM and get a better item)).

I'm not asking for extremes. I think FF XI's 72 Hour Window (or camping HNMs on a 21 - 24 Hour Respawn Timer) may have been "fun" for people in a certain situation in their life, but nowadays it feels too extreme and silly.

But there's no denying that getting your Kirin's Osode, O. Kote, Empress Hairpin, etc. (Original drop rates, early years) really felt like an accomplishment. Beating Dynamis-Xarcabard for the first time (pre-nerf, early years) felt like a great accomplishment. Beating Chains of Promathea (pre-nerf) was fun.

On the other hand, I'm happy for the convenience of FF XIV, but pretty much every NM fight (even the original Dodore, Great Buffalo, etc.) feels like a "Oh cool. Yay."-type of moment, instead of a...

"HELL YAH! WOO HOO!!!!!!! We did it!!!"-type of moment.

Who wouldn't want to have a great sense of accomplishment when playing FF 14?

Right now, beating up Bardi or Queen Bollette, or Downy Dunstan, feels like a "Eh. No drop. Look for the ~1 minute repop." Rinse and repeat.

When you get a drop from the Mid-Level NMs, you feel mildly happy and leave to do other stuff.

So what's the "ideal re-entry / cooldown time"? I think everyone has their own personal limit, but 5 minutes before retrying seems really short.

Betel is right that this caters to Hardcore more (since they have the dedication to repeat constantly until it's done), but I think what Richard and others are saying is that it's good to have content that can last longer than what we have now.

Ultimately, we'll have to see what the Dungeons are like, and maybe the 5 Minute Cooldown is there for a reason (like people disconnecting / crashing and wanting a chance to get back in quickly; or the drop rates are super rare with lots of confusing / alternate paths, so we have to figure it out repeatedly), but if not, this may be similar to the 20 Mid-Level NMs we got in terms of feeling of accomplishment. We'll see.

[Raze]

My initial reaction was "grrr damn it I'm going to smash through this in a weekend".

Then I thought "Wow, when those people got all upset that DC's might cost them a dungeon run they got the same way, and this just cured that."

So, my approach is going to be:
Wait
See
Judge

Keep hopes low and every cool feature is a bonus!

[Sagagemini]

We need a community rep in here asap to clear things out lol.


I play 3h~ per day.
So, I would be able to do 1-2 dungeons a day, considering there's a gather up and get ready time.
Sounds pretty good to me, since there's more than one path per dungeon and the drop rate wont be that good.

But yea, hardcore players would get things done a lot faster and "run out" of content pretty soon.

[DurtiMonkeyToe]

Hi All,

While the 5 Minute (basically non-existent) restriction to re-enter Dungeon might be super convenient and helpful to cater to anyone playing the game, there is one aspect that FF XIV is suffering from as a result of this type of convenience:

* Lack of Feeling of Genuine, Major Accomplishment.

By this I mean the feeling you get for accomplishing something that made you get up and shout in elation and relief over defeating / overcoming / gaining something that was rare.

The last batch of 20 Mid-Level NMs are a perfect example of what Richard and some others are talking about:

* After the initial buzz of maybe... 2 or 3 days (if that), no one really cares about those 20 NMs any more.

The Drops don't feel special at all. There is no great sense of accomplishment for getting a drop from an NM that respawns within 1 minute to 5 minutes of being killed (with a decent drop rate).

Now, on the other hand, it *is* very convenient and allowed pretty much everyone that put a little bit of effort into it, gain their very own Unique / Untradeable NM Weapon / Armor. So that's great for everyone just wanting to get an item to use (which has also hurt the crafters for items in that range (since many people with means can just hunt the NM and get a better item)).

I'm not asking for extremes. I think FF XI's 72 Hour Window (or camping HNMs on a 21 - 24 Hour Respawn Timer) may have been "fun" for people in a certain situation in their life, but nowadays it feels too extreme and silly.

But there's no denying that getting your Kirin's Osode, O. Kote, Empress Hairpin, etc. (Original drop rates, early years) really felt like an accomplishment. Beating Dynamis-Xarcabard for the first time (pre-nerf, early years) felt like a great accomplishment. Beating Chains of Promathea (pre-nerf) was fun.

On the other hand, I'm happy for the convenience of FF XIV, but pretty much every NM fight (even the original Dodore, Great Buffalo, etc.) feels like a "Oh cool. Yay."-type of moment, instead of a...

"HELL YAH! WOO HOO!!!!!!! We did it!!!"-type of moment.

Who wouldn't want to have a great sense of accomplishment when playing FF 14?

Right now, beating up Bardi or Queen Bollette, or Downy Dunstan, feels like a "Eh. No drop. Look for the 1 minute repop." Rinse and repeat.

When you get a drop from the Mid-Level NMs, you feel mildly happy and leave to do other stuff.

So what's the "ideal re-entry / cooldown time"? I think everyone has their own personal limit, but 5 minutes before retrying seems really short.

Betel is right that this caters to Hardcore more (since they have the dedication to repeat constantly until it's done), but I think what Richard and others are saying is that it's good to have content that can last longer than what we have now.

Mid-level NMs weren't made for your r50 CON. They WERE created for the large population of players that didn't level past r25/r30 because there was nothing to do. And THESE players DO consider it an accomplishment. All the proof you need is riddled on youtube by many "MIDCORE" Linkshells who post videos of them defeating these NMs.

[Betelgeuzah]

not the point. Sky, the actual dungeon, was ALWAYS up and had no timers on it at all. So, I don't see the problem with 14's dungeons, the dungeon itself, not the content inside, having a 5 min cooldown.

Haha

As long as the content inside has a timer! Brilliant.

[Chardrizard]

You get feeling of accomplishment by beating a difficult content, not by giving it a cooldown.

a content with cooldown and no challenge will not gives u sense of accomplishment.

[DurtiMonkeyToe]

My initial reaction was "grrr damn it I'm going to smash through this in a weekend".

Then I thought "Wow, when those people got all upset that DC's might cost them a dungeon run they got the same way, and this just cured that."

So, my approach is going to be:
Wait
See
Judge

Keep hopes low and every cool feature is a bonus!

Thank you! This is how a rational adult reacts. There may be trepidation, or concern, but at least THEY WAIT UNTIL THEY KNOW FOR SURE to start complaining.

[DurtiMonkeyToe]

We need a community rep in here asap to clear things out lol.


I play 3h~ per day.
So, I would be able to do 1-2 dungeons a day, considering there's a gather up and get ready time.
Sounds pretty good to me, since there's more than one path per dungeon and the drop rate wont be that good.

But yea, hardcore players would get things done a lot faster and "run out" of content pretty soon.

Not necessarily. Even farming the top level NMs for hours on end, it took my Linkshell a long time to get all the gear we wanted and needed.

[RabidSquirrel]

I have this great idea, guys! Okay so get this: You finish or fail the raid, and then...don't try again until tomorrow! Genius, right?

It's seriously sad you guys need a mechanic to force some restraint upon yourselves.

[DurtiMonkeyToe]

I have this great idea, guys! Okay so get this: You finish or fail the raid, and then...don't try again until tomorrow! Genius, right?

It's seriously sad you guys need a mechanic to force some restraint upon yourselves.

AAAAAAANNNNNNNDDDDDDDDDD /thread