Isnt it time that white mages got buffed to level of Schoalr already?

[Vlady]

Its starting to become obvious to even the diehard scholars who deny the gap between the two classes when 4 out of 5 pvp teams have a scholar over a white mage and Turn 6+ BC groups running double scholar on the high end guilds.

Scholar+pet is now churning out heals that is double the strength of cure two and not many fights in the game requires burst medica use as it did in turn 1. Its more about burst on a few targes which the scholar can patch up way quicker then a white mage utilizing pet on one target and physick on another target. Lets not even get started on damage mitigation/superior utility and cooldowns/superior dps in form of dots which gives scholar time to continue to heal and almost unlimited mana.

[Tranquil]

I don't know anything about PvP, but balancing PvE around PvP is not a good idea at all. Thus, if SCHs are as preferred as you say they are in PvP, separate adjustments for that are perhaps in place.

Now, as far as SCoB goes, I've yet to see anyone purposefully run dual-scholars. What kind of edge does that give? There is no Infirmity-gimmick like in Turn 5. Thinking about it, anything is doable, but some turns would be very annoying with just two scholars. Yes, I am a SCH main, but I do think the healer balance is good in this game at the moment - I do play both and have cleared all content. Apart from stuff like SoS scaling with Piety or having stuff like Presence of Mind be a bit more useful, I don't see much wrong with the WHM at all. Maybe some new skills or additions could help with the interest levels, but those will likely follow with the level cap increase anyway.

[Clouse]

I prefer whm over sch for just about every fight. That being said, both jobs are pretty well balanced. The best groups, imo, have a whm and a sch for heals. They work well together.

Pvp is another story. But with future updates we dont know what jobs will be popular in pvp. Depending on how they do the new pvp fights, whm should be on equal ground with sch.

[Vlady]

Honestly I would not understand why you would perfer a white mage over a scholar. White mage has a superior burst aoe group heal and an aoe damage stun. Minus niche tactics like turn 2 enrage timer it is inferior to a scholar in almost every way. I love my main scholar but even I see the shear difference in power between my class and the weaker white mage for 90% of content in this game so far. It favors scholar so much it is silly. Easy to figure out patterns make reactive white mage healing obselete on even aoe healing when a sacred soil and a preshield spread of aldo and succor win out.

[Okashii]

Honestly I would not understand why you would perfer a white mage over a scholar. White mage has a superior burst aoe group heal and an aoe damage stun. Minus niche tactics like turn 2 enrage timer it is inferior to a scholar in almost every way. I love my main scholar but even I see the shear difference in power between my class and the weaker white mage for 90% of content in this game so far. It favors scholar so much it is silly. Easy to figure out patterns make reactive white mage healing obselete on even aoe healing when a sacred soil and a preshield spread of aldo and succor win out.

You're running with some bad WHMs. The job is all about timing.

[Tranquil]

Why are you acting like the WHM is so inferior in everything? More than anything, what you are describing is a hypothetical situation with top-tier players where they have mastered the content and try to push the runs to just a tiny bit faster with the off-DPS potential of 2 stacked scholars. Even then, due to the subpar synergy (compared to SCH/WHM), the scholars will have their hands more full than they would with a WHM partner, relatively speaking. Sure there are some instances where the raid-healing is very lenient for the most part, such as Turn 9 which is solohealable anyway, but that doesn't mean the WHM is suddenly useless.

A WHM can put out single target heals worth of 585~ potency without much mana loss over time, without Divine Seal, simply by Cure 1'ing, having Regen up and Cure 2'ing upon Freecure proccage. When Divine Seal is up, this becomes about 760~. That's not bad at all for a healer who is supposed to have its niche in raid-healing, burst healing and on-demand healing. (And that's just for the "maintenance healing", don't even get me started on the full-burst potential).

Yes, scholars are powerful. Yes, I don't mind playing with a skilled scholar. No, WHMs are not bad.

[Raestloz]

Why are you acting like the WHM is so inferior in everything?

I really don't see why WHM could be on par with SCH right now. SCH, being born out of a DPS, is capable of BOTH DPS and Healing, that alone is already superior

SCH's damage relies on DoTs that allows them to both healing and dealing damage at the same time.

Pure heal-side, SCH has a healing bot that not only allows it to churn out Cure 2 at half the MP rate, they also churn out Cure 2 at half the enmity. In Raids, AoE heal is much less of a problem, the content is based around keeping the tank alive after all, so the incredibly awesome Lustrate is an absolute winner. 3x25% heal every single minute? Yes please. Not to mention you can stack it before engagement, additional usage.

In comparison, WHM only has a Benediction which has a 5 minutes cooldown. Divine Seal works for WHM, fairy's boost affects EVERYBODY's. In short, Divine Seal only improves Cure, fairy boost also improves Second Wind. SCH's Adlo/Succor will never be wasted, especially if Adlo crits. If a WHM crits, some of that might be wasted. WHM's 2 minutes MP regen means more risk if the healer dies and needs to regenerate MP, SCH's every-minute MP heal is much more lenient. What about Medica 2? Fairy's AoE heal gotcha covered.

Even better, while WHM only has Holy, SCH has Selene, which improves skill speed/cast speed every 1 minute, works even if SCH themselves are out of MP

No, WHMs are not bad. Yes, SCH is much better than WHM.

The advantage WHM has over SCH are Holy and Regen. Holy deals a lot of damage, Regen allows you to heal over time without supervision and can be cast whenever. Other than that, SCH laughs at the pitiful existence of WHM.

SCH and WHM overlaps far too much, to the point that SCH eats up WHM's job. This, coupled with the narrow vision of "keep the tank alive" mechanics, means WHM's superior AoE heal is, just about all the time, useless.

[Tranquil]

-snip-

You have a few good points but you are glorifying the SCH and not really thinking about the WHM's strengths to the end.

Like, what does Fey Illumination working for everybody and Divine Seal working for the WHM only have to do with the WHM being inferior to the SCH? In practice, the WHM is getting a 50% healing boost and the SCH is getting a 20% boost, if both are active. Divine Seal is super good and on a 1m CD. You can have 11 ticks of Divine Sealed Regen up per minute. That is, 33 seconds out of 60 seconds. (Dots and HoTs being on a 3s timer per tick, refreshing Regen at the end of DS). On top of the Cure 1'ing and Freecuring, this is some good maintenance healing.

Ignoring the use of Fey Illumination and assuming a WHM uses a few Cures during their Divine Seal used on cooldown, on top of maximizing their DS'd Regen uptimes, they're looking at about 620 potency of highly mana efficient healing without doing a single Cure 2 outside of Freecures. (With average Freeproc rates, and with the average Regen potency being 174.5 if 11/20 ticks are DS'd and 9/20 'normal', per minute). Scholars can maintenance heal at about 655-660 potency (Physick + Embrace). Yes, 655-660ish, not 700, because while Embrace is listed as 300 potency, it actually is in the 255-260 range. Assuming you Rouse on cooldown, that comes closer to 690 potency over time. Not a drastic difference in mana usage or potencies, considering the other excels in ST healing anyway.

Yes, I know Scholars have Lustrates, Adloquium and all the goods, but so does WHM have the on-demand healing. Whispering Dawn is good but it can be up 1/3 of the, not on demand all the time. Yes, a SCH's shields get wasted less than a WHM's heals even when overhealing happens, but guess what, a WHM has their godly 18% stoneskin, too, that they can cast instead of a healing spell.

[Raestloz]

You have a few good points but you are glorifying the SCH and not really thinking about the WHM's strengths to the end.

Like, what does Fey Illumination working for everybody and Divine Seal working for the WHM only have to do with the WHM being inferior to the SCH? In practice, the WHM is getting a 50% healing boost and the SCH is getting a 20% boost, if both are active. Divine Seal is super good and on a 1m CD. You can have 11 ticks of Divine Sealed Regen up per minute. That is, 33 seconds out of 60 seconds. (Dots and HoTs being on a 3s timer per tick, refreshing Regen at the end of DS). On top of the Cure 1'ing and Freecuring, this is some good maintenance healing.

Ignoring the use of Fey Illumination and assuming a WHM uses a few Cures during their Divine Seal used on cooldown, on top of maximizing their DS'd Regen uptimes, they're looking at about 620 potency of highly mana efficient healing without doing a single Cure 2 outside of Freecures. (With average Freeproc rates, and with the average Regen potency being 174.5 if 11/20 ticks are DS'd and 9/20 'normal', per minute). Scholars can maintenance heal at about 655-660 potency (Physick + Embrace). Yes, 655-660ish, not 700, because while Embrace is listed as 300 potency, it actually is in the 255-260 range. Assuming you Rouse on cooldown, that comes closer to 690 potency over time. Not a drastic difference in mana usage or potencies, considering the other excels in ST healing anyway.

Yes, I know Scholars have Lustrates, Adloquium and all the goods, but so does WHM have the on-demand healing. Whispering Dawn is good but it can be up 1/3 of the, not on demand all the time. Yes, a SCH's shields get wasted less than a WHM's heals even when overhealing happens, but guess what, a WHM has their godly 18% stoneskin, too, that they can cast instead of a healing spell.

Because fairy boost means things like:
Second Wind
Additional Slotted Cure/Physick in BLM/PLD's skills
Arcanist Physick

Are all boosted, and is more useful to the party as a whole, even the other healer gets the effect, as you say.

I do not argue that Divine Sealed Regen plus Cure 1 is good, but so does boosted Physick + Embrace + Fairy Regen, and is objectively even better. When fairy boost is not active, Scholar can use Rouse to improve the healing of Fairy by itself.

You're also forgetting the fact that that SCH's 660 potency comes with only the cost of Physick's MP, while WHM's also comes at the cost of Regen's MP cost

The equivalent of Whispering Dawn for WHM is Medica II, which has been "nerfed" by reducing heal potency and increasing regen time. As much as I don't want to admit it, Medica II is pretty much only useful for TitEx and T2 Enrage, mainly because on-demand healing is usually about "keep us from dying, right NOW" in this regard, both AoE regens are useless, but while Medica II generates an incredible amount of enmity (which can cause current monsters to aggro the WHM), Dawn will direct the aggro to fairy. Medica II also comes at unnatural MP cost.

Every second you're not healing is a second wasted not healing. While it is true that Graniteskin grants 18% of max HP mitigation, it requires 3 seconds to cast. By comparison, Aldoquium requires only 2 seconds to cast.

If we assume that a target has 10000 HP (currently only available to Warriors), Graniteskin will grant the target with 1800 HP. That's the top line. Now, I'm not going to kid myself and provide exact numbers that are accurate about Adlo's potential, because I don't know the way cure potency mechanics work, but suffice to say that if Adloquium crits and heals for 600HP (the heal itself), the shield will be 1200 HP, which easily trumps Graniteskin, if only due to the more efficient MP cost and faster cast time.

And you simply don't crit for 600 in end-game, you'd crit for more, especially thanks to Warrior's 20% heal buff. If the Heal crit is 650, the shield will be 1300, for a total of 1950 HP.

I'm not going to lie to you, my Cure 2, with Divine Seal crits for 3.6-3.8k. By comparison, my Cure usually crits for about ~1500. Considering that Adlo's potency is 300, its crit will probably hover around ~1200, which will bring its effective potency to ~3800. Graniteskin has to cover a target with 20.000 HP just to scratch 3600 damage mitigation

Stoneskin is effective, it simply isn't efficient. When you take into account that Adlo's crit doubles its shield's strength (which is already the amount of heal to begin with), its potential busts through the roof. Stoneskin scales with target, Adlo scales with YOU. Stoneskin's advantage is the 30 minutes long up time, but mid-battle it's rarely useful, unless your alternatives are worse (such as when used by Paladin)

[peaches]

snip

Just thought I'd chime in and give you the Adlo numbers. My Adlo cures for ~800, and ~900 on Warriors. My crits are normally between 1200-1400, but with Convalescence up (and possibly Fey Illumination) I crit somewhere between 1500-1900 (could probably be 2k+ crits if I made sure it was on a WAR, with Convalescence, Fey Illumination, and possibly a Monk's Mantra), and regular Adlo heals for ~1000-1200.