Relic Spells/Abilities

[Lucke]

So, we have relic weapons that can be updated, but how about a relic spell or ability? Hear me out:

The Relic spell or ability is available at 50. Each job gets their own ability. Need to have the relic weapon first. The ability is gained from a quest just like job quests. The ability can be relic bound or free (depends on how the devs balance it)

Relic Bound: Can only be used while the Relic weapon is equipped.
Free: Can use used regardless of weapon.

The ability is something that has to be iconic for the job it is applied to.

For example, PLD gets "Hold the Line". They crash their Holy Shield into the ground and bunker behind it. Defense doubles but they are Bound, Pacified, IE can't act or do anything for the duration. The duration starts at like 5 seconds, but as you upgrade the ability duration increases. Or wait, that's a little too close to HG. Maybe they get like "Enlight" or something. Give them religious undertones since their shield is called "HOLY SHIELD"

WAR would be "Enrage". For the duration, WAR do not consume Infurate when using the abilities that cost Infuriate. So they can spam SC non-stop while Enraged.

MNKs could get "Hundred Fists", etc.
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The idea here is to make Atma farming worth it. If you have the disciple to keep at it, you get a relic weapon, and a cool ability for your time. Of course, now that I wrote this, we'll prolly see "Relic ability onry NOOB!" in the PF lol.

It would be kinda hard to balance it, but still....I would like to see Relics as the best weapons in the game. Right now, why would anyone get an Atma weapon, when Levi weapons are just as good. They are friggin LEGENDARY weapons, they should be the BIS. But, they are practically handed to you at 50.

These abilities could also function like a personal Limit Break people seem to want.

Maybe Novus weapons will blow everything else out of the water.

[Kitru]

The ability can be relic bound or free (depends on how the devs balance it)

If it's relic bound, you're basically forcing the ability to be near worthless or forcing players to completely ignore any weapon other than their relic weapons. In all likelihood if/when they add relic abilities (they've released email teasers suggesting that there is going to be some kind of special ability unlocked through your relic quest), they will be unattached to the relic itself. I also don't expect it to be upgradable simply because that requires it be a bit too useless when you first get it (think Bloodbath on a PLD) to really appreciate it (plus, if it's continually upgraded, it could very quickly get imbalanced when it gets upgraded for the 4-5th time).

As to the effects, I expect any ability unlocked through your relic quest to be either utility/capabilities that are currently absent for the job (WAR gets an additional interrupt, such as a stun or a short distance KB; PLD gets a t3 combo attack for Riot Blade that's low enmity) or an extremely long CD uber ability (SMN and SCH get some kind of uber-summon that appears for either a short time or a single attack; WHM gets something like Reraise that instant heals a target if they are reduced to less than 1 within 10 seconds of application), but only for those classes explicitly missing a given capability.

Your idea for a WAR Enrage would be pretty borked, given the potency of the Wrath consumers (rather than imagining SC spam, imagine IB spam) and giving PLD another tank CD would upset the balance between the tanks currently (you're buffing WAR DPS, which is already plenty high, and buffing the PLD CD suite, which is already really good).

I would like to see Relics as the best weapons in the game. Right now, why would anyone get an Atma weapon, when Levi weapons are just as good. They are friggin LEGENDARY weapons, they should be the BIS. But, they are practically handed to you at 50.

It's because they want the average person to actually be able to get their relic weapon, rather than restricting it to a tiny subset of players. If the relic weapons were as strong as the absolute endgame weapons (which is what happened in 2.0 when Zenith weapons were as strong as the Allagan weapons), there's no real value in the absolute endgame weapons. If you have to beat the absolute endgame to see your relic weapon, almost no one ends up with it (which is what happens in games like WoW wherein the Legendary weapons are owned by like 2 people on the entire server).

The relic weapons aren't supposed to be the best weapons possible. They supposed to be a high quality weapon that you can get without having to do the absolute endgame if you're willing to put in a good deal of effort. A "hardcore" raider is going to find it easier to get a TW weapon (or their SCoB weapon) than to get the Animus, but someone who doesn't raid all the time and only managed to get their relic weapon by getting a series of lucky DFs is going to find it pretty much impossible to get a TW weapon so their only option is the Animus weapon.

In short, SE wants to provide a viable path for casual raiders to get decent weapons, and the relic questline is just that. They also want to provide a viable path for casual raiders to get decent armor/accs as well, which is why there's soldiery gear. The advantage of hardcore raiding is that you can get your gear more "quickly" and with less associated grind.

[subteraneanbird]

I'd say another advantage of raiding is better customization of stats. Going full soldiery set for any class sounds really bad, as every set has some pieces that are stinkers. Some more than others (looking at you Daystar...), but overall that's exactly it. Relics and tome gear are so people who don't have access to the bleeding edge of content can still improve their gear over time.

[Garlyle]

For the reasons of impact on freedom of weapon selection as outlined above, I'm against the idea of relic-specific abilities.

HOWEVER

Giving some of the 'ultimate' skills special or enhanced animations when using your Relic - eg Hallowed Ground, Perfect Balance, Benediction, etc. - would be awesome.

[RickmanUK]

Personally i'd Love Job/Relic Specific Limit Breaks.

BLM: Remains the Same, Meteora/Meteor is Pretty Iconic for Black Mages.
SMN: Aether Strike/Aether Burst/Aether Flare: The Summoner calls forth all of there Summons for a Massive Strike on a Single Target/4 Targets/All Targets in Range
WHM: Nature's Blessing/Nature's Gift/Natures Bounty: Calling upon the Powers of the Elementals the WHM heals Everyone for a Large Amount/And Places Stoneskin on them all/And Raises and Fully Heals them all.
SCH: Ancient Mysteries/Ancient Knowledge/Mythical Restoration: Tapping into the Knowledge of the Ancient Nym, The Scholar Heals Everyone and Places a Full Galvanise (Crit Effect) on them all/Replenishes Allie Mana/Fully Resurrects all dead.
WAR: Avenging Anger/Furious Avenger/Last Man Standing: Applies Vengance (For Free) Bloodbath and Restores a % of HP Based on Allies Health (Lower=More)/Applies a % Damage boost Based on Allies HP/Applies Thrill of Battle Based on Allies HP.
PLD: Remains the Same... Maybe a Change in its Name/Animation.
MNK: 100 Fists/1000 Fists/Devastation: Restores TP and Removes GCD for 20/30/40 seconds/Applies Perfect Balance/Applies Internal Release and Buffs Damage Dealt by 20%

Could Come up with More.. But that's just a Small idea.

[Lorielle]

This idea can actually work if you actually think about it. Originally, as stated it would prevent people from being able to use what they want(Granted people for BiS anyway)...It sounded something similar to how some of the weapons worked in FFXI. However, doing a certain amount of something would enable you to use this skill regardless of what weapon you are using. Sure, you'd be forced to use your Relic for a bit, but you'd get a new skill out of it. There you go. Gives some value to your Relic and some reason to use them instead of getting them and tossing off to the side for whatever reason.

[sheepysheepy]

from a dev. pov it might be more viable to say, add 2 seconds to HG if using holy shield animus, Meteors aoe increasing a couple of yalms with stardust rods, cure2 healing the whm for 5% of what they heal the target for with thyrus

or similar little 'benefits' that don't really cause anyone clearing second coil to switch their gear?

[Kitru]

or similar little 'benefits' that don't really cause anyone clearing second coil to switch their gear?

2 extra seconds on HG would most definitely be enough to make sure that every PLD is using their Animus shield (the increases to stat bonuses and block value/rate based on ilvl are minute). Getting a couple more yalms out of Meteor could easily make or break hitting extra targets with it (it would most definitely let you hit Levi and Levi's tail along with all 4 spumes which is, on it's own, a huge damage increase). Healing yourself for 5% with Cure II basically eliminates most of the need to heal yourself as a WHM, which frees you up to do a crapload more other stuff.

Any benefit you provide that is exclusive to relics is either not going to matter, be entirely situational such that it's the de facto choice for some encounters and pointless for others, or so powerful that it doesn't matter what other options are around.

It was actually a good idea for the devs to remove set bonuses from end game gear because it actually allows players to make choices about their gear without being worried about screwing themselves over by losing a bonus. In other games, I've ended up with an awesome piece of gear that I couldn't use because it would break the set bonus; I had to wait until I got another piece (which took several weeks) before it was actually useful to me *even though it was higher ilvl*.

Set bonuses along with any special bonuses (like increasing durations or other special effects) basically prevent players from actually using all of the gearing options available to them. If the devs make it so that any combination of end game gear gives you the set bonus, what's the point of the set bonus in the first place? At that point, it's just a passive bonus.

Any special traits or abilities based off of the relic quest would need to be straight up rewards for completing the quest that you have available to you regardless of whether the weapon is equipped (this can already be done as evidenced by job abilities along with a number of class abilities). Honestly, I have no problem with this because it encourages players to put in the work to get it and provides a nice, tangible benefit for the quest even when you've got a better weapon equipped (even if it's the same ilvl, sometimes the relic just has absolutely terrible stats on it).

[Exstal]

I think if they gave people rewards akin to what Sheepysheepy is offering as a quest reward, it would almost make it required for later raid content lest you be less effective.

[Kitru]

I think if they gave people rewards akin to what Sheepysheepy is offering as a quest reward, it would almost make it required for later raid content lest you be less effective.

Eh, I don't really see a problem with having a certain level of progression through your relic quest being *required* for extreme end raid content. Up until 2.1 when they added the EX primal weapons, it was basically required as such.