Nerfs are making the game less fun for "many" hardcore AND casual players

[MasamuneBranford]

I am a casual player. Just because I am a casual player doesn't mean I don't enjoy a challenge. To many, nerfed content is not fun. It's not fun playing the final two 2.0 storyline dungeons and seeing I-level 100 players slaughtering the end boss within seconds. It's not fun fighting boss battles with a 50% to 25% echo buff (it's also not realistic to expect others in a group to turn the buff off). However, I'm also down to earth and realize that the game does have significant road blocks that can make the game less fun for some. However, I feel that the only battles that "possibly" warrant such a nerf at this time are Twintania and possibly Titan extreme. Why is anything else being nerfed?

Patch 2.1 brought Garuda extreme, Titan Extreme, Ifrit extreme, Ultima hard, crystal tower and various hard mode dungeons. A mere 3 months later, and a 25% echo buff has been implemented to Ultima and the three extreme primal battles and the maximum I-Levels have increased by 25. Why is content being nerfed in 3 months?

As a casual player who has many real life responsibilities; i'm finding it hard to get to the challenging content before it is nerfed. Three months is not enough time. If I-levels are going to continue to raise - I think SE needs to evaluate which instances truly need the echo buff and think about implementing a stat cap for certain trials / instances. The whole buff system seems to have been just thrown at a large chunk of content without much thought.

[Foo01]

I am a casual player. Just because I am a casual player doesn't mean I don't enjoy a challenge.
....
As a casual player who has many real life responsibilities; i'm finding it hard to get to the challenging content before it is nerfed. Three months is not enough time.

There you have it. The three month time is your challenge. It is plenty challenging because you do NOT feel you have enough time. There is nothing wrong with content being more accessible. We don't need elitist lording it over all the other players.

[MasamuneBranford]

There you have it. The three month time is your challenge. It is plenty challenging because you do NOT feel you have enough time. There is nothing wrong with content being more accessible. We don't need elitist lording it over all the other players.

So basically you're telling me that I'm an elitist because I think that I-level 110 gear does not belong in level 50 hard mode / expert dungeons, chimera, hydra, crystal tower, HM primals battles? These are battles that were tuned to be "fun" and not difficult to begin with (with the possible exception of Titan HM). The more nerfs that are added and the greater the i-level cap rises, the less fun these particular content activities become and the longer brand new players / casual players have to sludge through to get to fun challenging content.

[Vahlnir]

So basically you're telling me that I'm an elitist because I think that I-level 110 gear does not belong in level 50 hard mode / expert dungeons, chimera, hydra, crystal tower, HM primals battles? These are battles that were tuned to be "fun" and not difficult to begin with (with the possible exception of Titan HM). The more nerfs that are added and the greater the i-level cap rises, the less fun these particular content activities become and the longer brand new players / casual players have to sludge through to get to fun challenging content.

They have also given us alternate ways to catch up and will likely continue doing so. The nerfs allow catching up at a reasonable rate to access current challenging content. It's an MMO so you will need to invest some time in the game if you have fallen behind.. Plain and simple.

[SDaemon]

So basically you're telling me that I'm an elitist because I think that I-level 110 gear does not belong in level 50 hard mode / expert dungeons, chimera, hydra, crystal tower, HM primals battles? These are battles that were tuned to be "fun" and not difficult to begin with (with the possible exception of Titan HM). The more nerfs that are added and the greater the i-level cap rises, the less fun these particular content activities become and the longer brand new players / casual players have to sludge through to get to fun challenging content.

Less fun for the better geared you mean? Even when they were released the difficulty and fun were in question for those that already over-geared it. The longer the game goes on the more catch-ups that will be introduced to where a fresh 50 wont even have to sludge through those dungeons etc. Most early end game dungeons like WP and AK already serve very little purpose for fresh AF players

[Foo01]

So basically you're telling me that I'm an elitist because I think that I-level 110 gear does not belong in level 50 hard mode / expert dungeons, chimera, hydra, crystal tower, HM primals battles? ....

The elitist want content difficulty to never change so only they can access the new content and riff-raff unclean masses can be stuck. That is being elitist. Content being nerfed so more people can accesss them is not being elitist. Allowing players to farm and gear up iLevel 110 is also an indirect way to nerf the content. If you are against those ideas, then you are siding with the elitists.

If you don't want to use your iLevel 110 gear in HM primals, more power to you. I'm sure you got iLevel 90 or 75 gear around. So go do that, but do NOT impose your play style on the rest of the playerbase. They should have the freedom to do what they want. Only elitist will try to dictate and constrain how and what they play. SE wants to be more inclusive, a elitist wants to be exclusive.

[joab777]

That is the exact reason for echoes I believe...or one of them. Its to help casual or new players catch up to the newest content. The release of the PS4 version may hav had a lot to do with it.

But I do believe that with every new content patch, the hardest content should remain so until the next big patch...maybe two. Ot allows vets to be challenged and new ppl to catch up. Once they do, they will be playing next new unnerfed content.

Casual players may be in trouble...but many of them like it b/c they dont have time. Its unfortunate but its an mmo and requires a lot of time.

And its impossible to keep everyone happy.

[Cyrus-Wallace]

And they just realized that with Coil.

Greetings,

Since the introduction of the Echo bonus to the Binding Coil of Bahamut, the development team has been looking at the number of times players have been challenging it as well as the number of parties that are clearing the content each day.

We originally announced that every two weeks we would be increasing the Echo bonus; however, looking at the current rate of clears and the balance of the rewards being obtained, we’ve decided to halt increasing the bonus further.

The team will continue to look at the conditions day to day as we move forward and consider increasing the bonus further if it is deemed necessary.

If you get the Echo during ex battles, it's because you're wiping. So, the time invested to stack a nice amount of Echo means that they're not ready of that content or they make a lot of mistakes. That means that the content is somewhat challenging.

[MasamuneBranford]

If you get the Echo during ex battles, it's because you're wiping. So, the time invested to stack a nice amount of Echo means that they're not ready of that content or they make a lot of mistakes. That means that the content is somewhat challenging.

I apologize if I misunderstand what you're saying - but are you saying that if you die enough to see the echo that the content should be nerfed because it's too difficult? I completely disagree. A boss should kill your party on your first try. If it doesn't - then the boss is too easy. Part of the fun of a game is to learn from your mistakes and get better. I agree that there are many bosses that are too difficulty that players won't ever complete them. Those I can see the justification for a nerf down the line. But simply dying to a boss and getting the echo should not indicate that the nerf belongs. Many players want to figure out how to beat the boss without assistance.

[Orophin]

I agree that there are many bosses that are too difficulty that players won't ever complete them. Those I can see the justification for a nerf down the line. But simply dying to a boss and getting the echo should not indicate that the nerf belongs. Many players want to figure out how to beat the boss without assistance.

SE is thinking long term here. Imagine a year from now when there's a ton of content to do and new people (yes, a game doesn't just stop getting new people after a year) are held back from completing their first relic weapon because they can't find enough people or skilled enough people to take down Titan HM. You think those people are going to stick around?

I'm not saying SE needs to give handouts to everyone, but a little bit of assistance on content that isn't meaningful to the scope of the game at that current time isn't a bad thing. SE want players to actually experience their game, not be hung up on one boss for three months. If that's the ONLY content to do at that point in time, then sure, let them work for it, but when we're several months removed from that content and there's bigger and better things to do, there's nothing wrong with relaxing the requirements a bit.