Considering hanging up my shield due to high level haters.....

[Amberion]

in an exceptional amount of time / effort learning mechanics

Most, "not all", probably only want people to have a clue of what to expect. I by that i don't necessary mean watching a vid, more like reading up what moves bosses has and where to stand. At least then mistakes can be kept to a minimum.

At least that is how I look when it comes to team play. But that can also factor in that i come from games with death penalties.

you can tell me what to do or you can watch me die over and over again

Just a question. If you don't have anything against someone telling you about the fight, why not look it up before?

[Doo]

I'm surprised this is an issue in dungeons. All of them are so easy and straight forward or just takes a second to explain each boss. Most of them are basic tank and spank as well. If dungeons are making you consider hanging up your shield, then it's best to just do it now since end game is going to be worst.

[KingOfAbyss]

So, the [...] players in this game are starting to grind me!

When did it become mandatory to watch YouTube videos before a fight? What happened to enjoying the game and learning the mechanics? Are these people who only started playing games after YouTube was invented?

When did games become about speed running and kicking people after one wipe. Why.... Dear god.... Why? Haha.

Trust me, I feel and support you on this. I blame SE for making it that way, in majority. Now of course with my limited playing time, I want to make sure my 3 hours will be well-spent.

SE should make (sadly) 2 (3?) different ways to get into the same instance.

1- First-timers who wants to enjoy every cutscenes, didn't watch a VID (no, it's not a requirement to enjoy the game.)
2- The rest who will skip the cutscenes, but will enjoy the content, clearing EVERYTHING, uncoveraing all treasures, having a blast with people, FC or not. (I think this is where I belong and feel it should be intended that way.)
3- Speed Runners, and Tome Farmers. (enuf said)

You are far from being the only one - a community, like in real life, is composed of many different forms of peeps with many different views. - it's not bad, but in real life you get to choose if you want to be with them, or not.

A game is far from that: you have no choice but to be mixed from bad apples.

SE 'tried' to help: Party Finder. If you clearly state your intentions about how you want to do a specific trial/dungeon/whatever, those who will join you, agree to your conditions.

For me, its take the FUN out of simply gaming with everyone, more formal like in the real world, which I want to escape by playing a game and having: FUN.

Not the best loot (we all want it, sure) FUN factor is first.

I would suggest you to stick with a good FC that has the same goals than you, helping you through all of the stuff that make this game great.

If there is none on your server, come join us!

TL;DR: don't let the minority of 'bad seeds' getting what they want, from the majority of fun that you can get.

[kidvideo]

It's kind of an unspoken distinction: You need to start a party finder learning group to "experience" content. Duty finder's want to speed run for their tomes.

But generally I agree with you. I'd rather experience & learn what to do... rather than try to remember youtube instructions. I prefer to only resort to internet guides if I'm stuck on something.

[elreed]

It doesn't hurt knowing the fight mechanics before going in, I understand the feeling, I tank regularly and theres a lot of bad healers and dps that when everything goes wrong they blame the tank, in this game the tank role is the most difficult, you need to keep the boss hate on top all the time, dodge stuff and survive when the healers aren't curing wisely, so basically you wont get bored in any fight or dungeon, you are the one who control the entire run, sometimes this can be very demanding.

[Foo01]

You don't need to be in high level dungeons to find elitist jerks trying to force you to speedrun. Although they come in all types, the overgeared level synced BLMs seem to have the biggest attitudes of them all. I had more than one of them jump the gun on you to pull aggro even while you are marking the mobs. And then they tell you flash more, like that is going to help. They are basically like the tail gating !@#% on the freeway. They even vote kicked me because I asked them not to pull before I do. And heck this was just toto-rak.

I joined right back and asked who is going to do tank duty, and BLM claimed he was doing a better job. So I just made the BLM tank the rest of the dungeon because he wanted to be such hot stuff. I switched to healing, usually healing the healer, but since the BLM was going to tank I was not going to draw aggro. But he was too chicken to tank the final boss.

[givemeraptors]

Entering a dungeon like Ruins of Ampador or heck even Ampador Keep with an i60-something tank tho....that would be tough regardless, 1 bane I would get swarmed. You cannot fault players for being irritated at the slow pace when someone chooses to come undergeared when there are so many ways to get better gear out there.

...you mean like running Amdapor Keep or Ruins of Ampador?

That tank is not undergeared, you're overgeared. If you want to put out l33t DPS without slowing down, you'll have to deal with stealing some hate now and then. Nothing in those dungeons should be able to kill you. Besides, I would say it would help to pull some eyes off the tank in Ruins of Amdapor just to lessen the heat they're taking.

I'll just point out SE have an FAQ in the game support menu that states they can't deal with disputes on things like gameplay strategy (I take this to mean players can vote kick if they want a speedrun and you don't, or can boot you for being "bad" at the mechanics) or watching cutscenes. However, I'd encourage reporting too for things like insults, harassment, rudeness.

Unclear about speedruns (I'm going to go out on a limb and say "no"), but you most definitely CANNOT kick people for watching cutscenes.

The tank is responsible for running the group through the dungeon and knowing the mechanics. If you're not willing to do a little research before you waste people's time in a dungeon then maybe you should play a dps.

I want to see you run EX + Coil, or heck, even CT with DPS that don't know dungeon mechanics. Curious how far you'd get.

[Nadrojj]

I want to see you run EX + Coil, or heck, even CT with DPS that don't know dungeon mechanics. Curious how far you'd get.

This is the point where DPS actually have to have knowledge of how to play their job, EX and Coils. Other than that you can literally take someone who has never played the game before, let them read tool tips on their skills and run dungeons. Some evidence of this? Our bard's fiance filled in for him for two runs of brayflox last night while he took his kids to soccer practice she'd never played the game and was able to hold her own for the most part. DPS anything non coil/ex related is pretty roll face.

[givemeraptors]

This is the point where DPS actually have to have knowledge of how to play their job, EX and Coils. Other than that you can literally take someone who has never played the game before, let them read tool tips on their skills and run dungeons. Some evidence of this? Our bard's fiance filled in for him for two runs of brayflox last night while he took his kids to soccer practice she'd never played the game and was able to hold her own for the most part. DPS anything non coil/ex related is pretty roll face.

Please, tanking and healing anything pre-EX/Coil is pretty rollface.

SCH's can AFK entire low-level dungeons, MRD/WAR can overpower 3-4 times than go to sleep until the mob is dead. WHMs can regen everyone and go make dinner, PLD just does one combo over and over while tabbing through enemies. At certain times in certain dungeons the pressure ramps up on one role or another (Bray healer, Stone Vigil tank, Qarn DPS) but it's all pretty easy.

[Gnova]

I was in a group where neither the tank or healer (me) were over geared.
There was a BLM in the group and instead of just trying to run the zone as he would normally would he actually took time to sleep adds and help the situation.
95% of the time a BLM would only have made it worse by aoeing everything, grabbing agro, dieing, and then bitch about the tank not holding agro and the healer sucks because he died.

The first was a good, old school, mmo player.
The second was a one dimensional player who thinks he is good but actually sucks because he can't switch gears depending on the situation.

But... You really should take a few minutes to watch a video so you understand the mechanics. That 10 minutes will save you hours.