Changing Class in Dungeons

[Gnova]

I love all the fact that people that introducing a system into the game where you need a complicated flow sheet to understand how it works is "simple".

There are so many variables that need to go into making the system less abuse friendly that 75% of the people wouldn't understand it.

Just leave it as is and don't be bad enough to chase off your healer or tank.

[Ddmk]

I love all the fact that people that introducing a system into the game where you need a complicated flow sheet to understand how it works is "simple".

There are so many variables that need to go into making the system less abuse friendly that 75% of the people wouldn't understand it.

Just leave it as is and don't be bad enough to chase off your healer or tank.

Wat if they have a irl emergency of get a power cut and won't be back on why should the other members have to wait ages

[brewbane]

As a main DPS w/ tank and healer, I see the attraction to this idea, as re-queue takes longer. But if they're going to implement a system to allow class changes but involves loot rights, I'd rather they just add a much simpler "lot as this <single> job instead of the one you have equipped" option that you can use all of the time, that set pre-dungeon as part of DF and can't be changed in an instance.

Regarding switching jobs mid-run to speed clear trash and have melee LBs on bosses, I don't really see an issue w/ it. Trash is trash, and PF groups consider things like melee LBs when they're forming that DF doesn't seem to account for. Or the whole "4 melee vs Atomos" thing that seems to wipe runs more than it arguably should. Or boss mechanics - I'd much rather have someone switch to Bard and silence ADS rather than have (2) DRG and (2) BLM. (Which I'm picking b/c those are the jobs I'm most often on.)


The number of "if only I was on <job I have leveled/geared> for content" comments I read (or think) whenever we're looking for <key job> is notable.

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I know the whole "pick the job you'd lot on" concept opens up other cans of worms, so let me state for the record I the GUI I would envision would have the same level/ilevel checks for the job you've selected when you queue for the dungeon. To use me as an example, I could bring my i90 BLM to Turn 1 and lot for my i74 DRG, but not my i68 WAR.

Since I can greed lot it for a job that doesn't meet either of those requirements, I don't think it's a crazy proposition.

[infinitezero]

As a main DPS w/ tank and healer, I see the attraction to this idea, as re-queue takes longer. But if they're going to implement a system to allow class changes but involves loot rights, I'd rather they just add a much simpler "lot as this <single> job instead of the one you have equipped" option that you can use all of the time, that set pre-dungeon as part of DF and can't be changed in an instance.

Just... no. Too many people would do exactly what you're describing, and that is very unfair to those who need the drops for the class they're actually playing. The way it's set up is the way it should stay, as you need to be skilled and geared enough to run the content as any given class in order to get drops for that class (unless you ask and someone lets you have it because they don't want or need it). Why should a black mage have to roll against a paladin for gear upgrades in Duty Finder pugs? Hint: They shouldn't.

On topic: If done right, I would welcome a system like this with open arms, but many raise valid points about the potential for abuse. Here are my thoughts on one possible way it could work that minimizes the possibility of abuse. Please feel free to poke all sorts of holes in this if you can:

1. Class switching is only allowed once per dungeon. Once as in only one person can switch one time.
2. You can only switch classes to the class of a dropped party member, so the party composition required for Duty Finder is never changed.
3. The other 2 remaining party members must both agree to allow the class change.
4. You can only need roll on gear for your original class until a replacement has joined, at which point you become only able to need roll for your current class.
5. Vote-kick functionality and searching for a replacement are both disabled when there is loot on the table. It is also disabled after defeating any boss that rewards chests until those chests are opened and loot has been distributed.
6. Loot timers should also be shortened to accommodate the above to prevent abuse of the loot timer lockout feature. Realistically, a 1 minute timer on treasure chests would be plenty.

Thoughts?

[infinitezero]

I love all the fact that people that introducing a system into the game where you need a complicated flow sheet to understand how it works is "simple".

There are so many variables that need to go into making the system less abuse friendly that 75% of the people wouldn't understand it.

Just leave it as is and don't be bad enough to chase off your healer or tank.

The only people that would 'need' to completely understand how it works are those who try to abuse the feature.
If someone drops, it could be as simple as "Cloudy Mcseph has requested a class change to Paladin. Would you like to allow this?" Majority votes yes, class change happens, then the search for a replacement starts. Simple, and gets the job done.

If people are trying to change the party composition (to say 3 DPS 1 Healer)? Error, class change only available when missing at least one party member, and only to that missing players role.
Attempting more than one switch per instance? Error, this feature is only allowed once per instance.
Trying to kick someone while there is loot to be rolled on? Error, d*** move detected.
Etc, etc.