Atma Fate System Broken

[C-croft]

Listen to you! You'd think the handful of trolls that got you so whipped up are the entirety of the opposition. It's amazing you have the gall to act like everyone who disagreed with you is running around calling people scrubs. It's even more amazing that you act like low percentage drops are something new to the genre.

Wow, so much anger....

[Worm]

Wow, so much anger....

Did that really sound angry? What part? Can you put it into words?

You can go look at his post history to see where one poster was trolling him about Atma and then notice the tone of all his posts change to where he essentially lumps everyone who disagrees with him with the posters who were trolling him. He repeats the line about "having put in more time than the people who are defending it" multiple times after that point.

[ApolloGenX]

You can go look at his post history to see where one poster was trolling him about Atma and then notice the tone of all his posts change to where he essentially lumps everyone who disagrees with him with the posters who were trolling him.

I didn't essentially do anything. No, I specifically scoped my statement to a "distinct subset of posters". I'm sorry, but trying to misconstrue that statement into "anyone who disagrees with me" is really reaching.

This is off topic though.

I am curious what metrics they are using to determine the impact of this design and how to react to it... that would be interesting to know.

[C-croft]

Did that really sound angry? What part? Can you put it into words?

You can go look at his post history to see where one poster was trolling him about Atma and then notice the tone of all his posts change to where he essentially lumps everyone who disagrees with him with the posters who were trolling him. He repeats the line about "having put in more time than the people who are defending it" multiple times after that point.

Your incessant need to be right and trolling people about their opinion, wants etc. and constantly acting condescending to others when there truly is no need. He is right you know. People have a tendency to not see the other side of things because they did get their ATMAs much faster than others. It's a natural thing outside of the game. There is definitely something off with the way ATMAs drop. Maybe there is a 'thing' such as the JP theory. But RNG or no, it doesn't explain a low drop rate meant to for grinding when someone can snag all twelve in a matter of a couple days and yet there are people devoting much of there time to running FATEs and nothing to show for it.

Looking back at the questline, it feels more like the ATMAs were meant to be a tiny bit grindy, with the majority of the grind being the tomes. Of course only SE can tells us, and I am sure they won't. The fact that they are 'incorporating feedback' regarding the way the quest works, the implementation was not quite what anyone expected. SE and players alike.

[Worm]

I didn't essentially do anything. No, I specifically scoped my statement to a "distinct subset of posters". I'm sorry, but trying to misconstrue that statement into "anyone who disagrees with me" is really reaching.

Oh come on, you entered this thread trotting out complaints about trolls and swung right back into it almost immediately after responding to me. It's your go-to anytime you're at a loss for a reply. Games have had drop rates like this for years, I'll repeat.

Your incessant need to be right and trolling people about their opinion, wants etc. and constantly acting condescending to others when there truly is no need. He is right you know. People have a tendency to not see the other side of things because they did get their ATMAs much faster than others. It's a natural thing outside of the game.

Woah it's a good thing not getting what you feel you deserve doesn't impart any kind of bias. Otherwise we'd all be susceptible to this critique and it would almost be a non-point. It's sure a good thing that no rationalization occurs when people don't get what they want. Oh my incessant need to be right, those too are points that could only apply to me and no one else.

But RNG or no, it doesn't explain a low drop rate meant to for grinding when someone can snag all twelve in a matter of a couple days and yet there are people devoting much of there time to running FATEs and nothing to show for it.

Actually it does exactly explain it! Some people got lucky, they're outliers! Naturally you're only going to hear about extreme cases on the forums. So you really think it's two groups of people, those who get it in a matter of hours and those who get it in a matter of weeks. When it's really most people falling somewhere in-between, like it always has been, for the whole history of these games.

That you think this is somehow 'Devil RNG' just makes me think you don't have much experience with this kind of grind. This is just how it is.

[ApolloGenX]

Oh come on, you entered this thread trotting out complaints about trolls and swung right back into it almost immediately after responding to me. It's your go-to anytime you're at a loss for a reply. Games have had drop rates like this for years, I'll repeat.

Can you think of many examples where high end quests involved a large number of extremely low rate drops in low level areas that were non-tradable? Usually a quest might have very few... and usually the drop rate is pretty decent, moving you through the low level portion, if there is one. Even farming prayer shawl components in EQ (lower level... but the zone could be a little challenge).. was maybe an hour of farming for siren hair. None of this spending weeks on rng junk. You go in, do your time and move on through.

Even that was soloing, not this zergfest type setup. (Oh and you collected gems and stuff while doing it that made it somewhat nice) - and those weapons lasted MUCH MUCH longer... shawl, too. I hung on to both until PoP... that was a couple of expansions. But please... share some example quests -and rewards- you think are comparable.

[C-croft]

snip

You asked me to put it into words for you. Please, continue to prove me right. Your superiority complex is amusing. Of course everyone else feels they need to be right, but calling yourself a troll and then continue to do so is of your own choosing. Also, I do enjoy how you assume things, but it's ok. Seeing a tough guy on internet forums always makes me smile.

[Worm]

Can you think of many examples where high end quests involved a large number of extremely low rate drops in low level areas that were non-tradable? Usually a quest might have very few... and usually the drop rate is pretty decent, moving you through the low level portion, if there is one. Even farming prayer shawl components in EQ (lower level... but the zone could be a little challenge).. was maybe an hour of farming for siren hair. None of this spending weeks on rng junk. You go in, do your time and move on through.

Even that was soloing, not this zergfest type setup. (Oh and you collected gems and stuff while doing it that made it somewhat nice) - and those weapons lasted MUCH MUCH longer... shawl, too. I hung on to both until PoP... that was a couple of expansions. But please... share some example quests -and rewards- you think are comparable.

I guess Epics would probably be the best comparison. I only know about EQ1 from my brother playing it, but I feel like you're really downplaying how long some things took.

Anyway I'm perfectly happy to say the way in which these items drop is dumb. I have other posts where I say that. The FATE grind is bad, totally, completely. Though none of that is an issue with the drop rate, the disparity in RNG, or RNG itself. The design is bad but countless people are jumping multiple fences and going from that bad design to say 'RNG is bad' and don't tell me they're not because a guy literally going around the forums calling it "bad RNG".

Though lets not get ahead of ourselves with bashing the Atma grind in favor of EQ1. EQ1 had many low drops not necessarily as low as Atma but that's just because they were low spawn too. Particularly, my brother told me it took his Guild Leader a year to get the Vampire Essence for her Enchanter Epic. Since invariably someone else got their Vampire Essence on the first kill this opens up to every critique you made of Atma. Obviously you have to take into account that EQ1 had contested content and long spawn timer mobs. Which are things that if implemented in to this game, people would freak out about in the same fashion they're freaking out about Atma, and then we'd have to hear about how those concepts are fundamentally flawed, and I would still disagree.

As for tangential benefits you do get Seals and progress toward achievements while farming FATEs, it's not amazing but a reasonable comparison to the stuff you were getting while doing your Shawl.

You asked me to put it into words for you. Please, continue to prove me right. Your superiority complex is amusing. Of course everyone else feels they need to be right, but calling yourself a troll and then continue to do so is of your own choosing. Also, I do enjoy how you assume things, but it's ok. Seeing a tough guy on internet forums always makes me smile.

Tough guy? Calling myself a troll? What are you even talking about? You're just babbling at this point.