Community misconceptions in regards to Atma

[Launched]

RNG is awful. You shouldn't be able to get everything handed to you on your first Fate, but it also shouldn't be possible for you to go 500+ Fates without getting a single atma. Get rid of the RNG and add something like shards, where you get one per Fate and need twenty, thirty or more to create the atma for that zone. At least it would be something you could see yourself progressing through.

[Edenholt]

I dont care about vocal minority it or wanting to have things handed on a silver plate that, all I care about is that I spent two entire weeks doing FATEs at Moraby. Before I didnt mind FATE and I even defended the concept in-game before... now I hate them. It's OK to make us *aham* "work" for an upgrade to our relics, but I'm quite sure there were better ways to put us to grind. The first relic quests were OK, kill the primals, fight for it. Many people still have trouble with Titan (both Hm and Ex...), so it's not like it was handed to people for free before. Now it's just a matter of luck, you can get your scale on the first try (happened to me) or spend an absurd amount of time until you get the next (me again). For 6 years I played LIneage2, one of the most grindy games ever, where to get your third class change you had to get 700 quest items from mobs, I'm a very patient person, I like to take my time doing things in game - unless it's raiding, I really dont rush with things. I don't even speed run dungeons. But, really, this atma quest is silly and not really worthy it (yet).

[AmyNeudaiz]

snip

We are on the same boat. I have done fates from 2.2 to now and I have not gotten any Atma still 0/12 and I am no closer to getting 1/12 from when I started weeks ago.

[Lunavi]

I personally hate both RNG controlled progress and FATE's, but am no stranger for farming for clear goals with stimulating content. So the second part of this quest even though it will likely take longer I will like more. It is nice in one way though that they make content all might like... I am however alittle sceptic against having to farm lvl 3 mobs to get a iLvl 100 weapon. Wellwell, I think we all know that SE does this to make us go outside of Mordor and show off to new players that there are alot of players playing this game.

Have you seen that they are advertising this game like crazy now and especially that part that we are over 2KK players? *hinthint on the real purpose of ATMA collecting*

[Worm]

Grinds and farms can be fun. Getting Insane in the Membrane was the most fun thing I did in World of Warcraft. I still remember tightening up my pick pocketing routes and memorizing pats.

Seeker, I just assume they're a poster whose first language isn't English and try not to mock them for it.

The simple fact here is that asking for it to not be RNG is actually asking for it to be faster, not much faster, but in the end anyone who would have went past whatever the linear progression you guys want is will have it faster than if they were dealing with RNG and went past that linear progression. RNG is by it's nature harder than token treadmills.

[SeekerScorpio]

Grinds and farms can be fun. Getting Insane in the Membrane was the most fun thing I did in World of Warcraft. I still remember tightening up my pick pocketing routes and memorizing pats.

Seeker, I just assume they're a poster whose first language isn't English and try not to mock them for it.

The simple fact here is that asking for it to not be RNG is actually asking for it to be faster, not much faster, but in the end anyone who would have went past whatever the linear progression you guys want is will have it faster than if they were dealing with RNG and went past that linear progression. RNG is by it's nature harder than token treadmills.

I was talking about mr 3k, not the one I'm quoting. Hooked on Phonics was a reading comprehension system not spelling/grammar. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooked_on_Phonics

Knowledge is power.

After reading both again, your comment doesn't even correlate to either one. We throwing random comments?

[Worm]

I was talking about mr 3k, not the one I'm quoting. Hooked on Phonics was a reading comprehension system not spelling/grammar. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooked_on_Phonics

Knowledge is power.

After reading both again, your comment doesn't even correlate to either one. We throwing random comments?

Jesus I misread your awesome hooked on phonics barb, holy shit I'm so sorry for this mistake. Maybe we could further analyze and work to understand this over dozens of posts?

[Suellen]

Feel the need to respond to the math debate in this thread.

Firstly you are right. If the drop rate for atma is 1% then you have a 1% chance to get an atma after every fate irregardless if you have done fates prior or not.

HOWEVER. If you look at it as a series rather than individual events you can look at the probabilities as a whole. Example if you are to commit to doing 500 fates irregardless if you get an atma or not your chances of not receiving at least 1 atma across that series is 0.6% (0.99^500). AKA very very low

Of course no one will do 500 fates irregardless of if they get an atma or not. They will stop once they receive their atma so the above example is not an accurate one.

Really what you need to do is use survival analysis. My survival analysis is a bit rusty but using an exponential model I estimate the half life of atma farming would be roughly 70 fates.

So while yes you can do 500+ fates and not receive an atma the fact is that's a very unlikely outlier scenario

[AmyNeudaiz]

So while yes you can do 500+ fates and not receive an atma the fact is that's a very unlikely outlier scenario

With a guess count of 10,000 players trying to get Atmas the odds of some of them not getting a single Atma in 500 fates times twelve (twelve Atmas) makes for quite a number of people getting screwed over by this quest.
In a fun game I wouldn't mind this but FATEs are generally not fun and people want to have fun in MMOs these days.

I'm sorry but you realise that the video you posted was always going to be head because the game developers programmed it that way
The Atma are not scripted to never drop are you oblivious to this point?

My goodness you are dense. Remove that point entirely since you apparently can not understand that it was a reference to statistical odds. Not an example of RNG.
What remains? My argument that people have constantly misrepresented the arguments of those against this quest which is the main point of the OP in which you have not even bothered to talk about. Good day sir.

people want the atma grind they can be carried through.

More proof that these people only have interest in misconstruing everyone's feedback.

[Suellen]

With a guess count of 10,000 players trying to get Atmas the odds of some of them not getting a single Atma in 500 fates times twelve (twelve Atmas) makes for quite a number of people getting screwed over by this quest.
In a fun game I wouldn't mind this but FATEs are generally not fun and people want to have fun in MMOs these days.

I recognize that there will be a handful of people with bad luck on one of their atma grinds and will fall in this outlier. But what do you mean times twelve? Are you saying that this person with bad luck will get bad luck through out all twelve atmas? If that was the case it's implying that it would take them over 6000 fates to finish their grind. This is astronomically unlikely.

To use the simpler example of a person will do 6000 fates irregardless of if they get atmas. The chances they will have 11 or less atmas is 0.000000000000593%. Even if a billion people were working on atma farming the chances that any of these would fall under such an outlier is low. Is it possible? yes. Is it probable? definately not.

While I recognize that a person might have a string of bad luck when farming one of their atmas they could just as easy have good luck on a different atma. In the end it will likely even out with I'd guess some kind of normalized curve with an average at the half life of 70 fates per atma.