DIP, DUCK, DIVE, DODGE!

[Black_Rose]

If you look at what people are doing with the kinect and playstation move, eventually MMORPG will apply that to their games. You hop here, you hop there, you swing a sword, you make certain motions with the wand to cast a spell. Turn based, stationary battle is a dying breed. MMORPGs will soon stop making people fat.

kinect with FPS action mmos.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZ91K...eature=related
i could see myself break a leg or arm jumping and rolling around in my room lol

[Dyne]

kinect with FPS action mmos.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZ91K...eature=related
i could see myself break a leg or arm jumping and rolling around in my room lol

I want something like that video where they are constantly moving and avoiding hits along with skillchain + magic burst combos with party. I think we are getting some sort of solo combos according to the famitsu interview.

[Firon]

While i do like action rpg's the thing that makes me tire of them is how retarded easy they are or how exploitable they are. In the end most action rpg's = this formula attack like crazy and have a healer you can rush thru most rpg's like this. Lets try the tale's series for instance while i love these game they are stupid easy same goes for star ocean you just need a healer and broken character.

Let's Check out Yuri Lowell from tales and see him make this game look easy. He can infinite any boss in the game once he gets an single hit on Example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ozmp_B0zwU

Then you have a game like star ocean with broken characters especially in 3 and 4

This vid is of Meracle abusing the dodging(blindside) system in SOTH to beat one of the hardest bosses in the game.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6wMbeKsgYU

Now these 2 vids are just examples of what i dislike about action rpg's always some exploit in them and they tend to lack the one thing all RPG's should have and that's strategy. Most action rpg's usually tend to be fun at first but it wears off fast cause the battle system end up like this game senseless button mashing.

Now don't think turn base rpg's don't have simple exploits they do but not many one of the biggest offenders of this is FF X(I already know a lot of you will go crazy of this but that game was down right easy and broken in terms of combat) this is for the people who will say X wasn't broken.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DcT3Cn33Ig0

[Dyne]

While i do like action rpg's the thing that makes me tire of them is how retarded easy they are or how exploitable they are. In the end most action rpg's = this formula attack like crazy and have a healer you can rush thru most rpg's like this. Lets try the tale's series for instance while i love these game they are stupid easy same goes for star ocean you just need a healer and broken character.

Let's Check out Yuri Lowell from tales and see him make this game look easy. He can infinite any boss in the game once he gets an single hit on Example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ozmp_B0zwU

Then you have a game like star ocean with broken characters especially in 3 and 4

This vid is of Meracle abusing the dodging(blindside) system in SOTH to beat one of the hardest bosses in the game.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6wMbeKsgYU

Now these 2 vids are just examples of what i dislike about action rpg's always some exploit in them and they tend to lack the one thing all RPG's should have and that's strategy. Most action rpg's usually tend to be fun at first but it wears off fast cause the battle system end up like this game senseless button mashing.

Now don't think turn base rpg's don't have simple exploits they do but not many one of the biggest offenders of this is FF X(I already know a lot of you will go crazy of this but that game was down right easy and broken in terms of combat) this is for the people who will say X wasn't broken.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DcT3Cn33Ig0

You're examples are a bit too extreme. Don't really want hyper speed dodge. I want something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSEbR...eature=related

[Firon]

[QUOTE=Dyne;220646]You're examples are a bit too extreme. Don't really want hyper speed dodge. I want something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSEbR...eature=related[/QUO

I know they are extreme but this is what usually happens with his type of game play the point i wanted to make is that action games end up more or less like this game button mashing with little strategy

[Dyne]

[QUOTE=Firon;220651]

You're examples are a bit too extreme. Don't really want hyper speed dodge. I want something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSEbR...eature=related[/QUO

I know they are extreme but this is what usually happens with his type of game play the point i wanted to make is that action games end up more or less like this game button mashing with little strategy

That's no different than the introduction of utsusemi in ffxi. If you're really good, you can do it so you won't get hit.

[Firon]

[QUOTE=Dyne;220660]

That's no different than the introduction of utsusemi in ffxi. If you're really good, you can do it so you won't get hit.

like i said i never said none action rpg's are without flaws and just ustu alone didn't make you broken its utsu + evasion set ups that made people broken.

[Winterclaw]

To the people who want a completely revamped combat system... didn't SWG try that and fail?

If SE was going to do that, it should have been the first thing to be started with the new producer because as others have said, it involves everything. FF14 was built around old school MMO combat so right now they should be focused on perfecting the existing system. I'm not saying that they can't change it, but it will be going back to square one and if there's no clear idea on what it'll be and they can't sell the new idea to the players, it'll be tough on them.

Another problem is you are changing the system... but to what? Let's say the copy Tera. Tera doesn't have the baggage. Also you are assuming that the new system will be better than the old system.

FF games are supposed to be about story. MMOs are supposed to be about "content". Those should be the primary foci of SE right now.

[Vanguard319]

To the people who want a completely revamped combat system... didn't SWG try that and fail?

If SE was going to do that, it should have been the first thing to be started with the new producer because as others have said, it involves everything. FF14 was built around old school MMO combat so right now they should be focused on perfecting the existing system. I'm not saying that they can't change it, but it will be going back to square one and if there's no clear idea on what it'll be and they can't sell the new idea to the players, it'll be tough on them.

Another problem is you are changing the system... but to what? Let's say the copy Tera. Tera doesn't have the baggage. Also you are assuming that the new system will be better than the old system.

FF games are supposed to be about story. MMOs are supposed to be about "content". Those should be the primary foci of SE right now.

As someone who played SWG before, during and after the abomination known as the NGE, I can wholeheartedly say that it was the worst revamp of an MMO ever. Not only did they halve the number of usable battle commands, but they also removed the ability to switch professions. At the time, SOE vowed that it change the game and make it more exciting, but in the end, it pretty much destroyed party play, and the only thing that was epic about the legacy quest that replaced party leveling was the massive migraine you would get. In addition, SOE released the Trials of Obi Wan expansion several days before the NGE, and so many players were enraged by the dumbing down and quit that SOE was forced to offer refunds to players who had pre-ordered the expansion. All-in-all, it's a textbook case of what NOT to do when overhauling an MMO.

This is also why I originally said no to radical changes in the players poll. You may come up with good ideas, but it's more likely you'll wind up with crap.

SWG char: Athrun Kai-Zal, master Carbineer pre NGE, lv 90 Drunken Jedi post NGE of the Ahazi server.

[Winterclaw]

This is also why I originally said no to radical changes in the players poll. You may come up with good ideas, but it's more likely you'll wind up with crap.

Agreed. If SE really wants a whole new combat system and are willing to invest the time and money into it, they would pretty much have to set up a test server just for that system, make sure any player can access it, see it, and give feedback on it, and then go through multiple iterations BASED ON THE PLAYER'S FEEDBACK before making it a part of the game. But that would take a lot of time, effort, money, and most of all willpower to do it right.

And as I said, it should have been started months ago.