Parry...

[MythToken]

I understand all of the above, but the case made for prioritizing dps secondary stats was made under the conclusion that the increased dps was actually a net gain of damage mitigation, over the parry stats damage mitigation.
^ if we assume this is correct then follow me down this rabbit hole for a second.

So IF you are tanking Turn 5+ and your HP pool is not an issue. I think it would be safe to say that migrating a few points out of VIT and into STR would be a significant increase in effectiveness.
Especially if you have now stopped gearing for parry and started boosting crit and det, which will both be further boosted by more STR.

I am not suggesting going +30 STR and 0 VIT. I AM saying that +5 STR/ +25 VIT +15/+15, ect are now worth looking at. Again this all depends on the fight, and your healers.
If you are not dying from boss hits, then adding STR seems like a very legit thing to do. Especially with changing 2ndary stats to dps.

[Kitru]

If you are not dying from boss hits, then adding STR seems like a very legit thing to do. Especially with changing 2ndary stats to dps.

That has always been the case though. The issue is that the content that you actually stand to run is always going to push your eHP because of the devs' love of spike damage. Even if you can reliably survive a DS, you're still basically guaranteed at least once per t5 to get a plummet>auto-attack>DS (or plummet>DS>plummet or plummet>DS with healers in a conflag or...) which still stands a reasonable chance of killing you before you get healed back up. Because you can basically assume that it'll happen, you should itemize around that event.

eHP is one of those weird stats where there is an explicit functional cap but you can never be quite sure if you're there or not because it's both situational and probabilistic. You can only be sure that you've got enough for the 95th percentile or what have you. Since the devs love spike damage so very much, it takes a fair deal of VIT to make sure that you're actually within those top percentiles that you want to be in. As such, unless you're running content that you explicitly outgear, you're better off going full VIT to make sure that you don't die because a dead tank is almost always a wipe, especially in progression content.

[MythToken]

Well obviously with T5 nerf/buff, spike damage is no longer an issue and its not progression.

In t6 a warrior having 8800 hp seems literally a waste, and no different from a warrior with 8200 hp. (except he would be doing less damage)

I havn't looked at t7. *edit i have looked at t7

t7 there are points where you turn defiance off as Warrior OT, and killing adds is a priority you are not taking huge bursts.

I think to sum it all up, pre 2.1 yes you needed as much VIT as you could get to survive death sentance. This is now irrelevant
Turn 6 - 7 this is not the case, or clearly does not look like it to me. Even MT wasn't taking THAT much damage in turn 7.
I am watching a warrior with close to 9k hp, its unnecessary, what is necessary is damage and lots of it.

The game has at least for these 2 turns, changed a bit. And maybe we should change our thinking.

Anyways love the thread, thanks for all the posts and contributions, I am out.

[bokchoykn]

snip

You're right about how much (little) VIT an OT Warrior would actually need. However, the reason I don't respec 30 Strength is because 3/5 of my Accessories are still i90 and can be swapped out for i70 crafted accessories. (-15 Vitality, +27 Strength, + A ton of secondary stats). If I wanted to take it a step further, I'd swap out Ribbon of Fending too. (-23 Vitality, +36 Strength, + A ton of secondary stats).

As you can see, I'm trading VIT for STR at a much better than 1:1 ratio, plus I'm gaining a ton of secondaries. Much more profitable than swapping 30 VIT for 30 STR.

I wouldn't respec +30 Strength AND wear i70 accessories. That's suicide.

[Remn]

I wouldn't respec +30 Strength AND wear i70 accessories. That's suicide.

why not ;D.
That sound fun !!!, it like playing Dark Knight on TaruTaru in XI LOL. but ya unless you want to keep farming the item to reset stat. Just swap out ring/neck.. is enough to push your DPS

[Remn]

T6 and 7 was never a tank check in the first place. it more of a DPS and Brain check lol. Now T8 is a different story.... xD

T7 boss don't hit hard, it the Blade dancer that hit like a truck.

I would still get as many VIT as I can for these turn anyway.
More HP mean the healer has more room to do some DPS or heal the team back up from fire ball or other stuff.

you can plan around the tank HP to add some DPS or raid heal as a healer but you cant do the same with parry as you don't know when you will parry

[SirTaint]

You're right about how much (little) VIT an OT Warrior would actually need. However, the reason I don't respec 30 Strength is because 3/5 of my Accessories are still i90 and can be swapped out for i70 crafted accessories. (-15 Vitality, +27 Strength, + A ton of secondary stats). If I wanted to take it a step further, I'd swap out Ribbon of Fending too. (-23 Vitality, +36 Strength, + A ton of secondary stats).

As you can see, I'm trading VIT for STR at a much better than 1:1 ratio, plus I'm gaining a ton of secondaries. Much more profitable than swapping 30 VIT for 30 STR.

I wouldn't respec +30 Strength AND wear i70 accessories. That's suicide.

Just get i100-110 str accessories. No different then OTs using i90 str accessories last month.

[bokchoykn]

Just get i100-110 str accessories. No different then OTs using i90 str accessories last month.

Yeah, I'll just reach into my bag of unlimited Soldiery Tokens, Oils of Time, and High Allagan Accessories...

I spend my Soldiery on tanking pieces and I pass High Allagan Accessories to my Monk and Dragoon, not that I can beat their Need roll anyway.

i90 STR Accessories can't give both Vitality and Strength.

i70 Accessories give both and a greater sum of both combined, plus way more secondary stats.

[ZDamned]

@Bokchoy: I did totally misinterpret that DPS Statement! =P
I also meant as an OT My Paladin can hit 245 in DPS accessories. I wouldn't tank ANYTHING like that, unless my group wanted me to. =P

@MythToken
Please stop talking about extremes here. Once we find a good HP level, you can slowly change out accessories in favor of Strength, but don't cut off your bonus stats. IMO, i like the 7200 number for T6 and T7. So For those turns I will slowly swap out my accessories in favor of DPS, but never will I dip below 7200 HP on my Paladin.
For Warrior, Vitality is EVEN MORE Valuable, because it scales better than any other class purely because of Defiance. Making it harder to justify removing those points.

Remember that this game is very situational! Each turn has a better way to run.

T8 Solo tanking is just a strategy to make the fight easier on the group, but not a crutch for a bad group. Also, gearing up with that Turn IF you fail to meet a DPS Check for it, will help you meet that check next time anyway. =P

I personally want to try solo tanking T7. I feel like the added DPS will help cut through the rough patches. There is so little DTpS on the MT in this fight, that CDs are almost totally unnecessary, so I feel like using them on Adds will actually make them useful. Then it will get the group out of the final phase even faster. May even skit the final ADD's Petrifaction all together, as well as limit the boss to only using it once.

[Basilisk]

Glad to see im not the only one using the i70 accessories lol.