Awful Tank luck today.

[IndigoHawk]

Imagine you have the best gear in the game. You want to get a Titan weapon. You defeat Titan a bunch of times, but there are no drops. Finally it drops. A low geared tank says they need it. You let them have it, because you think that's the right thing to do. Then you defeat Titan a bunch more times trying to get that weapon. Finally it drops. Same thing happens again.

That's not fun. Not only do you have to be lucky enough for the item to drop, you have to be lucky enough to not get teamed up with an undergeared tank.

Are you really willing to run Titan until every other tank in the game is geared before you can finally get the weapon? I doubt it. Your idea about need vs greed is flawed, because you're only thinking about what the undergeared tank needs, not why the overgeared tanks are playing.

[VargasVermillion]

Unfortunately for you when ever someone wants something for vanity there is never a 'good' time to get pieces as more often then not you'll get people who 'need' it more than you. however it is only thornmarch, there are better swords out there. Basically it just comes down to luck, if the other tank needed it and got the roll you'd probably complain about the RNG instead of people rolling on things they don't 'need'.

[VargasVermillion]

In the end you'll just have to accept bad rolls, For example I've been running coil turn 1 for the allagan body for vanity, one of the tanks that joined 'needed' it more then i did sure. However i have also done more runs than that person, they got the piece, sucks for me but It's fine. There will be other rolls.

[Huntington]

It may not be "fun" for me, but I would inherently realize that I've had my chance before I had the best gear. I don't truly require that Titan weapon anymore and I would be willing to let someone else who does require it to get it. That doesn't mean that I'm saying that I would continue to keep going for it though, I would theoretically have better gear and would realize that and quit going for it since it's a waste of time by that point.

The thing not anyone gets is that there are people in this game who don't even have a smidge of Allagan or 90 gear yet, they do need those weapons, I don't. In that situation, he should have been the better person and seen that I needed it. And when you have two tanks in most of that content, it doesn't mean you'll always have two Paladins or Two Warriors, there are still decent chances one of them will be a different type, and then the drop if it does drop, is guaranteed yours.

[Huntington]

In the end you'll just have to accept bad rolls, For example I've been running coil turn 1 for the allagan body for vanity, one of the tanks that joined 'needed' it more then i did sure. However i have also done more runs than that person, they got the piece, sucks for me but It's fine. There will be other rolls.

Except I was completely fine in the Titan HM run when the other tank got the Wall of Crags over me, I really do not care nor attempt to convey distaste for the RNG system itself, christ I've played Monster Hunter and FFXI ffs. The issue is that people know they're doing it just so they can have it sit in their inventory once after using it once while there will be other people that need it to make their character better so they can in turn play better. Gear is essential for Tanks more than any other class too.

[IndigoHawk]

I don't truly require that Titan weapon anymore and I would be willing to let someone else who does require it to get it. That doesn't mean that I'm saying that I would continue to keep going for it though..

You realize that your rules would probably make overgeared players give up instead of getting vanity weapons they want.

If you think about it more, you'll see why your need/greed rules actually make things worse for undergeared players too. Your rules discourage overgeared and undergeared players from grouping. Undergeared people group together so they can roll Need. Overgeared people group together so they can roll Greed.

This makes it harder for undergeared people because overgeared players have no reason to group with them and help.

Design a system that's fair to the overgeared, undergeared, and encourages them to play together. Such a system lets everyone work towards their goals by letting them roll on stuff they want.

[Huntington]

You realize that your rules would probably make overgeared players give up instead of getting vanity weapons they want.

If you think about it more, you'll see why your need/greed rules actually make things worse for undergeared players too. Your rules discourage overgeared and undergeared players from grouping. Undergeared people group together so they can roll Need. Overgeared people group together so they can roll Greed.

This makes it harder for undergeared people because overgeared players have no reason to group with them and help.


Design a system that's fair to the overgeared, undergeared, and encourages them to play together. Such a system lets everyone work towards their goals by letting them roll on stuff they want.

I don't I'm afraid.

There's nothing that should stop overgeared players from playing with undergeared, besides them not being the best at their jobs and making things take longer. I don't mind helping out someone get their relic or do random dungeons with any of my decent Jobs, but if something drops that they're not looking for, I'll greed on it if I could use it for another class. I don't get it, no problem, I'm doing this to help someone else anyways. If overgeared players go into lower tier Trials and the like and expect to get gear over other players for their vanity systems, then that's greed at it's prime. It's nothing but a fashion accessory for them at that point, why can't they inherently know that someone else might deliberately need that to succeed later on?

That's all I'm hinting at here.

[Zakalwe]

Haven't read past the first page yet, but to the OP, while this sux, you might want to rethink your FC if there is no one there willing to help gearing up new-to-50 jobs. In pugs, you get what you get. And BTW, on my PLD, my first to cap, I ran Ifrit and Garuda over 50 times and never got a drop. I finally tanked Titan with my ilvl55 GC sword and it worked fine.

[IndigoHawk]

Your loot rules only makes sense if people only play for two reasons: to get gear, and to help others get gear.

However, some people, like collectors, play for other reasons. They play Titan only for vanity weapons. Your rules discourage collectors from grouping with undergeared.

Collectors can be powerful allies with strong gear and expertise, so it's great to have them in a party. It's rude to expect them to give you all the rewards. It's fair for both of you to roll and let RNG decide who wins and who plays again. Everyone who works together on the challenge should get a chance to achieve their goals, including collectors.

Your system is fair for your FC or friends who agree with you that there are only two reasons to play: to get gear and to help others gear.
However, it's unfair for DF. In DF, people play for many reasons. When you use DF, show gratitude to powerful allies by letting them achieve their goals, too, which includes rolling for vanity.

[JonBigwood]

I think the OP already said his plans, but in case other fresh level 50 read this, I think the most practical thing is getting the ilvl 55 weapon from the GC (or equivalent, but Aurum Vale is not that hard and becoming second lieutenant is good, higher ranks may appear in the future), starting the relic quest soon, don't try too hard to obtain Garuda and Ifrit weapons (they are not that good.) At the same time you advance the quest without a lot of rush, upgear with drops or tomes (now there are no philo tomes to buy Darklight any more...) You'll probably be geared enough even with an ilvl55 weapon until then if you didn't have luck with the drops. While you try Titan HM, if you get bored, you can try also King Mogle, you might have the drop. When you beat Titan, you'll have the relic.

There are going to be more quests to upgrade the relics in the future, not just the ones now available, so it's worth it in the long run. The other weapons will always depend on the drops, and the other people who roll, you might be lucky or not, and new higher level ones will appear. They don't upgrade (at least for now), so you would need to obtain the new drops.