[Tank Shortage] Lv50 War/lv38 PLD resigning from ever using Duty Finder

[lxSch]

I was playing a war for some time and lately started leveling palading for fun and possible 2.2 class mount.
I was comfortable with tankers need to know every dungeon - i know them all very well.
I was comfortable with tanker being a leader and making pulls - not new to me, i ever failed pulls only when started playing.
I was ok with the fact until lv30/40 it's not very easy to hold aggro on mobs - i know enough tricks to hold it.
But lately i got the worst experience ever since i started playing ffxiv (worse than story dungeons with skip-scene bullying). They give exclusive mounts for high level tankers - ok, since update i will level up my remaining 12 levels using levequests, but not a single more duty finder.
What i got in one evening, in a row.
High level roulette, wp run - see screen: http://i.imgur.com/1GwZ69j.jpg
Brayflox - two mages who kept using aoe (whm asked them 3 times not to wake up mobs) and then dying because i cannot overflash their aoe, at least they didn't speak, but i decided not to go into brayflox again.
Qarn Temple (didn't make sc), owned by Bees, then bard started mocking me and i just left.
Qarn temple, see screen: http://i.imgur.com/Oh4BR0R.png
Qarn temple, team started normally, but bard grew very impatient and started making pulls before me and then circling around so i cannot do RoH. He told me to use flash - ok i use all mana on flashes, but it cannot hold anything (i36 set), so i just gave up and started attacking 1 mob - bard said i should change my job and the rest started mocking and laughing at me.
Queuing into low lever roulette to get this attitude? Never again, i have two healers and can wait 5 min or so it takes for healer duty finder.
My suggestion to new tankers and those who want to lvl up a paladin (since war has overpower and defiance at lv30): use levequests, they give enough exp to level up your job, and you will not be herrassed in almost every lv20+ dungeon at all! Once you are lv50 - use the Party Finder, since all 50+ content (except daily roulette that can be healed/dpsed) is very faily through the Duty Finder.

I can earn exp faster from doing leves then doing dungeons. I'm leveling my warrior right now who just hit level 47 and it was going far faster by doing leves then by going through a dungeon. Simple to say that its only worth doing the dungeon for the daily then moving on to leves for the rest. I earn around 18k-21k per leve and doing 4 of them just regular ones and can finish them in 15 minutes or less at times brings in faster exp then what a group would bring in through a dungeon. That's around 72000-84000 exp in around 15-20 minutes for doing simple leves.

[valho]

It's annoying when the party want to do speed run without actually making sure that everyone can handle it. A tank knows how much mobs they can handle but a dps does not and if the dps are not able to kill the mobs fast enough it's ridiculous to grab more mobs. If dps goes pull something without me I will just le them tank it, granted I may not pull multiple groups since my tank is not really geared but I do move pretty quick.

Fortunately levelling my tank through df was pretty enjoyable, I did not get harassed even though I did my fair share of mistake while tanking.

[lxSch]

I had a good experience while leveling WAR too, but PLD experience is different: no defiance, no overpower, dps need to follow the attack order or would loose hate (before RoH pld can loose it even on one target), if healer starts to dps or massively overhealing - i cannot take threat back from more than 1 mob (provoke).
I can imagine people may say very harsh words to the new pld tankers who make much more mistakes...

[Justsomeguy]

Ahh, pld. I got my gld to 22 for provoke and never looked back. Was losing hate left and right, hop on mrd use the same gear at 22...No hate issues whatsoever.

To be fair though, I've noticed a lot of poor/angry players gather at Brayflox and Qarn. Not exactly looking forward to tanking those, but oh well.

Best of luck to all newbie plds x-x;

[Alistaire]

I've been in those dungeons on both those jobs, what everyone was asking of you in every one of those situations is not hard to do, nor should a whm be telling aoe dps not to aoe fighting 3 mobs. I'm trying to figure out from what you've said why you couldn't/wouldn't handle it, idk best I can come up with is not everyone's cut out for tanking.

But it really, really, really looks like there's another side to the story and the people you had these bad experiences with, if they read this, would tell similar bad experiences of a tank that just didn't keep up like most other tanks in those same situations.

[Pizzaparty7]

In WP you go fast, this is just an accepted thing now. With decent dps it takes 20min max. Brayflox is not hard to hold aggro as you have flash and halone. Pull > flash > roh > flash repeat. Final sting on bees can be los'd. Sounds like you never learned to tank, you just spam overpower. Take some time and learn the class better. Threat pre 40 isn't hard. It's a joke after.

[Alistaire]

Heh, didn't know about los on final sting. It also can be stunned.

[krazyrs]

can click off regen.. i check it b4 every pull in df, some of these mages....

[lxSch]

- In WP you go fast, this is just an accepted thing now.With decent dps it takes 20min max.
- Brayflox is not hard to hold aggro as you have flash and halone. Pull > flash > roh > flash repeat.
- Final sting on bees can be los'd.
- Sounds like you never learned to tank, you just spam overpower.
- Take some time and learn the class better.
- Threat pre 40 isn't hard. It's a joke after.

- Not true, i did many slow WP runs as a whm/sch, it is not accepted unless team agrees or tanker rushes. Also look at healer's hp, it's not even i60 gear.
- You cannot hold aggro using flash alone, RoH cannot be used efficiently if team is attacking different targets and especially running.
- Where can i LoS the final stings in the square flat room?
- My standard routine: mark targets, pull, flash x3-4, kill targets by order, this way not a single mob goes loose.
- This thread is not about threat, but people's attitude (WP example). On war i can hold it easily (i do overpower for damage, but normally butcher's block + steel cyclone), but i cannot make people not being toxic.

I've been in those dungeons on both those jobs, what everyone was asking of you in every one of those situations is not hard to do, nor should a whm be telling aoe dps not to aoe fighting 3 mobs. I'm trying to figure out from what you've said why you couldn't/wouldn't handle it, idk best I can come up with is not everyone's cut out for tanking.

But it really, really, really looks like there's another side to the story and the people you had these bad experiences with, if they read this, would tell similar bad experiences of a tank that just didn't keep up like most other tanks in those same situations.

My main is whm and i always sleep #2 and #3 if tanker is pld/gla because i know it's much easier for him this way and does not drain my mana pool that fast.
I described above my standard routine, i do not claim to be a perfect tanker, but whose fault it really was?
- Healers massively overhealing (most common cure 2 spam), not reviving people, not sleeping loose adds (i can tell a bad healer easily), running away from me if they got a loose add.
- DPS ignoring attack order, ignoring boss mechanics, using aoe a lot (i attack #1, mnk/drg attacks #2, blm/smn/sch uses aoe), not watching their threat, kiting adds, and then shouting 'aggro, flash!".
Since i did those dungeons a lot as a healer, tanker loosing an add is a common issue there. Many tankers don't even bother focusing on bees so they go on healers, also many don't bother dodging aoe so healer spends mana very quickly. When i was a lv20 arcanist i said once to a lv20 tanker he should flash more, but it didn't help back then. Since that i never ever gave an advice to the tanker, yet i had this a lot recently from other players.

can click off regen.. i check it b4 every pull in df, some of these mages....

Yeah, i know about clicking buffs since i have a whm, but if other whm repeatedly casts regen right before tanker uses flash/overpower - things get complicated.

Ahh, pld. I got my gld to 22 for provoke and never looked back. Was losing hate left and right, hop on mrd use the same gear at 22...No hate issues whatsoever.

To be fair though, I've noticed a lot of poor/angry players gather at Brayflox and Qarn. Not exactly looking forward to tanking those, but oh well.

Best of luck to all newbie plds x-x;

In the monday i did around 8 brayflox in-progress runs in a row within 2h hours (evening), each time 2/3 bosses killed, team is good but quite offensive (using emotes a lot, rushing ahead and pulling patrol adds, firing before tanker) - i had no issue finishing the run with them, but i think they were rude to their previous tanker, so after he quit they probably went silent.

[Niamh_Felixis]

Duty finder will always be a mixed bag. There are how many people playing this game? Don't expect all of them to know what they're doing, or even to be reasonably human beings.

Qarn was a language barrier issue. So it goes.
Brayflox was dps not listening. That happens. If they want to pull agro off you after you told them to cut out the aoe, then tell the healer to let them die.
WP? Well, tell the party if you don't want a speed run. If they're not happy and throw you out, then so what? You're a tank. Reg again and straight in.

Most (70%) of the time, I've had good experiences in DF. If you need to learn to play a tank, do it in DF. Dungeon running teaches you to tank. Levequests? Not as much.