GLA <25 and keeping enmity

[Sadana]

If you mean really low level ones (16-18 or so), then holding enmity doesn't really matter.

Also remember, it's everyone's job to watch the enmity.

Yeah, the first handful of dungeons are what I'm talking about. I'm curious to hit level 26 now to see just how much of a different RoH makes. (Though it still won't be available in these dungeons.)

And YEAH... dat enmity. I learned to watch it early and still do. If I pull from a tank, I say I'm sorry. Now, I tell my friends at the start of a dungeon to help out by watching their own aggro. haha... Perhaps I should clarify and say HOW they should do this as well. >3< I know at endgame, many tanks pride themselves on not losing hate to overzealous dps and healers. (yay you guys! ) and they get used to going all out. But this isn't necessarily going to be the case at the lowest levels due to lack of skills or lack of player knowledge so I guess it won't hurt to remind people to watch themselves.

(eta: To clarify, if I'm running a dungeon with a tank that is not/will not/can not keep hate throughout, this is different and I'll offer suggestions on enmity skills.)

[Bardo]

I'm curious to hit level 26 now to see just how much of a different RoH makes.

It's pretty huge.
With just Fastblade+Savage Blade you're doing about 375 potency in enmity per global cooldown on a single target.
Add RoH and it jumps to about 683 potency in enmity per global.

So it gets pretty close to doubling your single target enmity generation.

[Sadana]

It's pretty huge.
With just Fastblade+Savage Blade you're doing about 375 potency in enmity per global cooldown on a single target.
Add RoH and it jumps to about 683 potency in enmity per global.

So it gets pretty close to doubling your single target enmity generation.

Whoa. That IS a big difference! :O
I should go level and try it out!

[Chiramu]

I find macros and tanking abilities don't go well together, if you need to do something quickly then you are stuck in a macro and can't do it quickly.

I find it easier to do things on the fly, the hardest dps to keep enmity off of imo is the BRD. Good BRDs have crazy single target dps and I've tanked with many who pop their cds on every trash engagement.

Just shield lob, enmity combo and do your best. It is a thankless job and not a guaranteed commendation either.

[Ultimatecalibur]

I find macros and tanking abilities don't go well together, if you need to do something quickly then you are stuck in a macro and can't do it quickly.

I make fairly heavy use of macros. It may be different for those using keyboard+mouse but I find them very good at enhancing my tanking ability.

Here are a few of the major macros I use:

Marking Shield Lob:
/micon "Shield Lob"
/marking attack1 <t>
/ac "Rage of Halone" <t>
/ac "Shield Lob" <t>

A fairly simple macro that marks the target before using Shield Lob on them or Rage of Halone if close enough. It can also be used off GCD to change what is marked.

First Blade:

/micon "Fast Blade"
/ac "Fight or Flight" <me>
/ac "Spirits Within" <t>
/ac "Fast Blade" <t>

This macro helps me make sure to use Fight or Flight and Spirits Within as close to "on cooldown" as possible.

Convalescence:

/micon Convalescence
/ac Convalescence <me>
/p Convalescence Up! Heals Boosted for the next 20s!

A macro to tell the rest of the party when Convalescence is up. Letting the healers know when their heals are more effective.

[Themis]

Nice to see another rise to the challenge of being a tank. Keep it up.

macro stuff

(Note: 'm not sure what the best way would be, but I do think it's best to go with what works for you rather than in general/best.)

I've started putting my macros the other way around, proccing the GCD before I use any buffs/OGCD abilities. I've gotten into the habit of weaving in 1 OGCD between GCDs, so having an OGCD go before GCD causes me to screw up at times (I'll hit Savage Blade thinking that Fast Blade went off, but it didn't because FoF did instead, for example). Not often, but when it happens, it's frustrating and not too great on keeping aggro.

I try not to macro too many things, as I prefer the option of deciding when to use particular things at specific times. That said, some abilities are either too staple (FoF) or just there because (Bloodbath), and those tend to be good candidates.

I have only two macros on Paladin (not counting party message ones):

/micon "Fast Blade"
/ac "Fast Blade" <t>
/ac "Mercy Stroke" <t>
/ac "Bloodbath" <me>

and

/micon "Savage Blade"
/ac "Savage Blade" <t>
/ac "Fight or Flight" <me>

I don't macro in Spirits Within, simply because I don't want to use it if I suddenly find myself with too much lost HP. Whilst I'm always watching for when the recast is up, I'm also always checking my HP and making sure I'm fairly high; maybe >75-80%. It's also worth not having macro'd because it has a Silence effect. Against some mobs, you really don't want to be wasting it just for the damage/enmity.

The issue you have, though, is that you do need to remember what buffs are on what macros. I don't have these accessible outside of the macros (I play on controller, so I try to conserve space as best as I can), so making sure I know where to find them is necessary. That's not too hard, though, as I have a good memory for that. But through this, I can do something like:

Shield Lob > (Flash here if multiple mobs) > Fast Blade (triggers Bloodbath) > Fast Blade (triggers Fast Blade) > Savage Blade (triggers FoF*) > Savage Blade (triggers Savage Blade) > Rage of Halone

*I don't like using this early, and prefer to have the damage bonus where the damage/enmity counts. There's too much wasted buff time if you have to Flash once or twice. On single target/bosses, it's not as detrimental, but multiple mobs, having FoF matter for longer means you can build better enmity when target cycling.

I will be adding that Shield Lob/RoH macro, though, minus the marking (if I ever have to use it again, I'll remove the marking). I never even thought about it, but RoH is a better choice if mobs happen to be close when trying to use it, considering the larger enmity bonus (even if potency/damage is less). I still tend to use Flash if I notice, though.

[Ultimatecalibur]

(Note: 'm not sure what the best way would be, but I do think it's best to go with what works for you rather than in general/best.)

Agreed. I just listed those to showcase the type of macros I use that can help out when playing on a controller.

I've started putting my macros the other way around, proccing the GCD before I use any buffs/OGCD abilities. I've gotten into the habit of weaving in 1 OGCD between GCDs, so having an OGCD go before GCD causes me to screw up at times (I'll hit Savage Blade thinking that Fast Blade went off, but it didn't because FoF did instead, for example). Not often, but when it happens, it's frustrating and not too great on keeping aggro.

I'm usually pressing until I see the GCD trigger before moving on to the next stage of the combo so I rarely run into that problem.

I try not to macro too many things, as I prefer the option of deciding when to use particular things at specific times. That said, some abilities are either too staple (FoF) or just there because (Bloodbath), and those tend to be good candidates.

Agreed. I actually have Bloodbath macroed into Rage of Halone.

I don't macro in Spirits Within, simply because I don't want to use it if I suddenly find myself with too much lost HP. Whilst I'm always watching for when the recast is up, I'm also always checking my HP and making sure I'm fairly high; maybe >75-80%. It's also worth not having macro'd because it has a Silence effect. Against some mobs, you really don't want to be wasting it just for the damage/enmity.

I have an alternate set up on control scheme 2 for fights where Silence Interrupting is nice/necessary that has a version of the FoF/Fast Blade macro without Spirits Within, but for anything but those fights I just use Spirits Within as an extra damage off gcd attack

The issue you have, though, is that you do need to remember what buffs are on what macros. I don't have these accessible outside of the macros (I play on controller, so I try to conserve space as best as I can), so making sure I know where to find them is necessary. That's not too hard, though, as I have a good memory for that. But through this, I can do something like:

Shield Lob > (Flash here if multiple mobs) > Fast Blade (triggers Bloodbath) > Fast Blade (triggers Fast Blade) > Savage Blade (triggers FoF*) > Savage Blade (triggers Savage Blade) > Rage of Halone

*I don't like using this early, and prefer to have the damage bonus where the damage/enmity counts. There's too much wasted buff time if you have to Flash once or twice. On single target/bosses, it's not as detrimental, but multiple mobs, having FoF matter for longer means you can build better enmity when target cycling.

My opening salvo for most fights looks similar:

Shield Lob > (Flash x 4 if multiple mobs) > Fast Blade (triggers Fight or Flight) > Fast Blade (triggers Spirits Within) > Fast Blade (triggers Fast Blade) > Savage Blade (triggers Bulwark) > Savage Blade (triggers Savage Blade) > Rage of Halone (triggers Blood Bath) > Rage of Halone (triggers Rage of Halone)

I will be adding that Shield Lob/RoH macro, though, minus the marking (if I ever have to use it again, I'll remove the marking). I never even thought about it, but RoH is a better choice if mobs happen to be close when trying to use it, considering the larger enmity bonus (even if potency/damage is less). I still tend to use Flash if I notice, though.

Yep 500/750 enmity for 60TP beats 360/540 enmity for 120TP.

[Sadana]

I find macros and tanking abilities don't go well together, if you need to do something quickly then you are stuck in a macro and can't do it quickly.

My opening macro actually speeds things up since I don't need to manually mark a target nor do I need to type into the party chat box. The only action taking place is Shield Lob so there is no interference with other actions.

[Rufalus]

Gladiator skills are very feeble at the low levels. I think unless the DPS are only hitting a single target then it's hard to hold everything, and even then your skills designed to raise enmity only barely keep you ahead of enmity drawn by others in the group. In my experience, a lv50 paladin playing endgame encounters is much easier to hold enmity, so in regards to that aspect the game gets easier as you progress to more difficult content which is odd. Low lv dungeons are harder to manage enmity but I wouldn't worry about it.

[AlexanderRed]

Gladiator skills are very feeble at the low levels. I think unless the DPS are only hitting a single target then it's hard to hold everything, and even then your skills designed to raise enmity only barely keep you ahead of enmity drawn by others in the group. In my experience, a lv50 paladin playing endgame encounters is much easier to hold enmity, so in regards to that aspect the game gets easier as you progress to more difficult content which is odd. Low lv dungeons are harder to manage enmity but I wouldn't worry about it.

Nice to know. alot of content in this thread has helped a newbie like myself. i somewhat know how to do my job. (although Macros on a PS3 controller seem DAUNTING to me for some reason)