Tips for grabbing BIG HATE fast.

[Darksword]

I play a WAR about a third of my time in FFXIV. Was never much of a tanker in the past, although I did run with a super hectic BLU/WAR magic tank back in pre-abyssea FFXI.

Certain fights in XIV, particularly certain bosses (looking at you, King Behemoth and Ultima HM) require the pulling tank to secure initial hate VERY quickly, lest the boss be pulled off by JAs or spells or whatever else the alliance is up to at the moment of the pull. A close friend tried MTing KB the other night, pulling with Shield Lob, and lost hate immediately. Since others might make use of the same info, I thought a thread might be in order.

What's your pattern for grabbing mondo hate-out-the-gate?

For my part, my standard opening rotation on bosses is:

Infuriate > Facepull with Inner Beast > Brutal Swing as I run through the boss > Tomahawk and Berserk as I pull him into position > Uncomboed Butcher's Block > Normal BB Enmity Rotation x2

[Altimis]

Overpower + Berserk

[Lemon8or]

Single target: Infuriate -> Unchained -> Berserk -> Tomahawk -> Brutal Swing -> BB combo.
Multiple targets: Infuriate -> Steel Cyclone -> Overpower x2.

[Maelwys]

On a mob that you know is about to spawn in the middle of a fight, build up a 3-part enmity combo on another target first: [Fast Blade > Savage Blade] or [Heavy Swing > Skull Sunder], then switch targets to the new mob when it spawns and use the final part of the combo [Rage of Halone] or [Butcher's Block]

On a mob at the VERY start of a fight, pop your DPS buffs before engaging, then just use an uncomboed [Rage of Halone] or [Butcher's Block] and then go straight into a fresh enmity combo.
Remember to rotate in off-GCD abilities in between each normal ability (Spirit's Within, Circle of Scorn, Brutal Swing etc) for a bit of extra hate.
After the first full combo lands, you should have enough of a hate lead. It's the first few seconds that are annoying; it's one of the few times that using an uncomboed RoH/BB is effective.

For groups of mobs, it'll be Overpower (or Infuriate > Steel Cyclone) spam for WAR and Flash spam for PLD.

Technically the biggest single-hit enmity gain you can get will be Internal Release + Berserk + Infuriate + Unchained then [Butcher's Block].
Do NOT lead off with Inner Beast; and only start off with Tomahawk if you can't close into Melee range.

[Alazier]

Infuriate, unchained, tomahawk 2 times as i run to my desired location. Then pop beserk and threat combo. No one is taking them back at that point.

[Rhime]

Can I ask what's wrong with pulling with Provoke followed by Tomahawk? I use a macro that fires provoke, 2 sec delay then tomahawk for pulling mobs.
Provoke has a 25yd distance while Tomahawk has 15.
Is this not a good enmity puller combo? I was told in one Titan hm run not to use it...

[Maelwys]

Can I ask what's wrong with pulling with Provoke followed by Tomahawk? I use a macro that fires provoke, 2 sec delay then tomahawk for pulling mobs.
Provoke has a 25yd distance while Tomahawk has 15.
Is this not a good enmity puller combo? I was told in one Titan hm run not to use it...

All provoke does is give you one point of hate above the "current highest" enmity source.
If you're just starting off on the mob, this means that nobody else has any hate, so you gain exactly one single point of enmity.

That macro would result in two seconds of anyone being able to pull aggro from you with a single autoattack (or more likely, using a single buff!)
Tomahawk is also only a 3x multiplier, to BB's 5x... so it only makes sense to use it over BB if you are too far away from the mob to use BB within the next 2.5 seconds. See here.

On Titan EM... I start off every fight by popping Fight or Flight as I run in, then smacking Titan with an uncomboed Rage of Halone as I run through his character model.
As soon as I'm through his model I'll use CoS > Fast Blade > Spirit's Within > Savage Blade > [Damage Resistance Buff] > RoH. Hate is now locked.



[Edit:]

If, during a tank swap, the other tank/healer/DD doesn't stop attacking until you can get into control they will keep the moster.

This.

When you're getting ready to tankswap you'll usually want to use the first two steps in your three-step enmity combo, THEN use provoke, THEN use the third step.
That gives you a sudden large spike of enmity over the other tank which is difficult for them to overcome "accidentally".

[Lemon8or]

Because using it at the start gives you 1 enmity. Provoke is supposed to be used to grab hate back from another party member. While it's true that it has longer range than Tomahawk, if your party thought you had hate and start using skills, bosses will go right after them.

[Echoloc]

Provoke sets you to the top of the list +1. So if you are starting the battle, you are at 1 and easily stripped. It is for tank swap machanics not hate building.

If, during a tank swap, the other tank/healer/DD doesn't stop attacking until you can get into control they will keep the moster.

[Traek]

Just get into your enmity combo fast. You say it is important to grab initial hate quick, but in reality no one is, or should be putting out large spells the moment you pull. On boss fights like KB, a simple Infuriate > Tomahawk > Unchained > Heavy Swing > Berserk > Skull Sunder > Internal Release + Brutal Swing > Butchers Block will keep hate quite secure. The other pull method I do that works without the rare BLMs Swiftcasting Fire III the moment I aggroe is, Infuriate > Face Pull > Unchained (just before melee range/aggroe) > Heavy Swing > Brutal Swing > Berserk > Skull Sunder > Internal Release > Butchers Block.

The weakness to that method is of course the time between Heavy Swing > Skull Sunder. The Heavy Swing + Brutal Swing is more then enough enmity to stay over first cast spells. Soon as Skull Sunder hits the game is over.

There is no reason to use provoke on pulls, unless it is in aggroe distance of others with Tomahawk, e.g. CT Trash with eyes + succubus just before Bone Dragon.