Really ... more iLv50 ish Dungeons

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Lots of good points made here. I would only add that while it's important to keep long-term/higher level players happy, we don't need to widen the gap between higher level and lower level. What I mean by that is, say 2.2 hit tomorrow: I'm i90, and you're. . . almost i60. The new content (hypothetical, for the sake of my point) is all i70. Great! I can jump right in. You, however are going to have to grind your way up just to meet the bar, but you work, you do school full-time, and you play other games too when you can. So here's all this new stuff that I can enjoy, but you can't yet. See where I'm going with this?

Now of course, there's more to it than that. And I'm not trying to paint the picture that either I'm deserving of the content because I put the time in to meet the requirement, or that you're not because you haven't. But that middleground must be maintained. If not, all that new stuff just becomes a glass ceiling for players who simply may not have the time to reach that minimum requirement. So setting the bar too high - while it may provide a more interesting experience at high level, is ONLY good for that, and nothing else.

[LordSaviour]

And I'm not trying to paint the picture that either I'm deserving of the content because I put the time in to meet the requirement, or that you're not because you haven't.

This. Right. Here. (Minus the "not")

Newer players should have to put in the same time to get to said content. People should follow the dungeon tiers.

This goes back to my point about Buying a game, popping it in and having the option to jump to the End Boss. It doesn't work that way.

Just because you paid for the game doesn't grant you access to the whole game without playing through it.

[L-D-Omlette]

This. Right. Here. (Minus the "not")

Which "not"?

You're implying that someone who started the game yesterday has to play six months before they are allowed to set foot in new dungeons. That's absurd. That would be analogous to buying a used game and not being allowed to buy any DLC until you've owned it for the amount of time that passed before anyone who bought it at launch did. Or better yet, watching Harry Potter and not being allowed to watch the sequels until years have passed in between.

Newer players should have to put in the same time to get to said content.

Why? Because you did? Better beat all content w/o watching any guides then, because someone before you did that, and it would only be fair right?

They are still going to have to put in some work. Is it as time intensive as you? Maybe not, but it's not like they beat Prae, and can immediately queue for these new ones.

[LordSaviour]

You're implying that someone who started the game yesterday has to play six months before they are allowed to set foot in new dungeons.

I'm not saying second for second, minute for minute, but if they put in the time to gear their characters appropriately to join a Duty, then by all means let them. If it takes them 2 Months or 6 months to reach Ilv89(my current iLv), I don't care. As long as they are ready to tackle the content.

But setting the bar so low that 'anyone' can join is just dumb.

[whiskeybravo]

They are still going to have to put in some work. Is it as time intensive as you? Maybe not, but it's not like they beat Prae, and can immediately queue for these new ones.

I do find myself a little jealous sometimes. A lot of our FC members are just getting to 50, whereas I used to tell them "Now the real grind begins" now it's like "At least you don't have to run AK until your eyes bleed for tomes" lol

[L-D-Omlette]

I do find myself a little jealous sometimes. A lot of our FC members are just getting to 50, whereas I used to tell them "Now the real grind begins" now it's like "At least you don't have to run AK until your eyes bleed for tomes" lol

This is what I think some of it boils down to.

I suspect people are upset that someone won't have to put in as much effort as they did. Or they don't want to be held back by people they feel like they are carrying.

To the first I say, you're gonna have to deal with it. My neighbor doesn't have to put in as much effort to get to work as I do, and I don't have to put in as much effort to clear the snow off my driveway. That's life. It sounds like you at least have a sense of humor about it, or understand the truth of that.

To the second, take the time to put together a group of like minded people. DF is there as a convenience to speed up grouping. The cost of that convenience is that you don't get to choose who you run with. You either spend time building the group, or spend time with the group. Rarely do you get the shortest period on both.

[Viridiana]

I'd say the first to clear T1 Coil had Full Darklight with a few Mythos sprinkled in and Relic Weapon(Maybe even Zenith). So more like iLv75. The gear check on Cad is pretty huge tbh. Tanks have to have proper gear to mitigate damage, healers have to as well to recover lost HP and DD have to down the snakes before an inevitable wipe from too may stack.

Would love to hear how they had myth pieces within the first week of launch. >_>

[Chihaya]

Low ilvl requirement for dungeons does not mean it is going to be easy, Pharos at ilvl49 or the extreme primals at the lowest ilvl through out the whole party would be difficult.

High ilvl gear on a character does not mean they are good, not knowing mechanics can easily cause a wipe... and some are unable to learn... like the QQ thread that a mnk made awhile ago about getting kicked from T2 because they kept getting cleaved to death by minis/ads. It was their first time doing it the way it is meant to be done, tank swapping.

[Alkimi]

I'd say the first to clear T1 Coil had Full Darklight with a few Mythos sprinkled in and Relic Weapon(Maybe even Zenith). So more like iLv75. The gear check on Cad is pretty huge tbh. Tanks have to have proper gear to mitigate damage, healers have to as well to recover lost HP and DD have to down the snakes before an inevitable wipe from too may stack.

When lots of people started clearing it sure. But the first people to clear it did with crappy gear. If you do the fight as intended, feeding the slimes even after the split, then you really don't need any gear at all, as the snakes hit for nothing with no stacks and the determination debuff. I think I was at i64 ish (on WHM) when we got our first Turn 1 kill, and one of our PLDs was still wearing AF body all the way up to our first T4 kill.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

This. Right. Here. (Minus the "not")

Newer players should have to put in the same time to get to said content. People should follow the dungeon tiers.

This goes back to my point about Buying a game, popping it in and having the option to jump to the End Boss. It doesn't work that way.

Just because you paid for the game doesn't grant you access to the whole game without playing through it.

That's not quite the main point I was making. And new players already do have to put in the time/effort to get to such content. No way around it. But setting the bar too high - as stated before - creates a player gap that's unhealthy for the player base and the game's lifespan. Imagine that when 2.2 hit, all the new content required an absolute i95 minimum requirement, and you JUST managed to finally hit a rough i80. In order to even get to the new stuff, you HAD to finish Coil 1-5, AND the EX primals, including Leviathan - oh by the way he's an i90 minimum (not really, this is for the sake of this point), oh AND let's throw in the next part of CT, which will also require a few FATEs to unlock. . .

Kinda sucks for you, huh? Now what about that guy who is JUST beginning to get i55 gear? Where's the fun in patch 2.2 for him? It's not about setting or keeping the bar low, but about finding that balance between the "high level" experience and what can reasonably be experienced and enjoyed by all players.