Any consensus on most important stats for WHM/SCH?

[Maelwys]

I doubt I have to "extra heal" compared to DET build

Depends on the situation...

A Tank getting hit for ~2200 HP per hit might need 2 cures to completely top them up on a Det/Crit build but 3 on a SS build.
Do they NEED to be completely topped up? Depends on the fight and what's coming next.

Likewise, a Tank getting hit for ~700 HP per hit might need only one cure from either build to top them up, but the SS build would be able to top them up slightly more regularly.
Do they NEED to be topped up more regularly? Depends on how fast the next hit is coming.

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A comparison of a WHM BIS SS build compared to a WHM BIS Crit/Det build is actually quite simple:

(1) BIS Crit/Det build (on my char, Seawolf): 513 MND, 436 Crit, 296 Det
Crit Adjusted Healing = 1152.654 HP recovered per Cure
SS is 391, giving a GCD of 2.450s (normal) or 2.077s under Presence of Mind.

(2) BIS SS build (on my char, Seawolf): 513 MND, 388 Crit, 235 Det
Crit Adjusted Healing = 1109.415 HP recovered per Cure
SS is 509, giving a GCD of 2.337s (normal) or 1.853s under Presence of Mind.


Difference in Raw Healing output per Cure: 3.751% in favour of the Crit/Det.
Difference in Cure Casting Speed: 4.588% in favour of the SS build.

This means that a tank can survive taking slightly heavier spikes of damage with the Det/Crit build (each cure landing heals for more), but they can survive taking slightly faster consecutive hits with the SS build (cures land more regularly).


Time until the SS build gets an extra cast: 21 GCDs (51.45 seconds)

This means that a SS build will become able to heal more average HP over time than a Det/Crit build after just under a minute of uninterrupted casting. Unfortunately due to movement mechanics and few on-GCD WHM spells being instantcast, this will not apply to many endgame situations.

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TL;DR:
+ SS build will be better than the Crit/Det build after 51.45 seconds of continual on-GCD casting
+ SS build will be be able to land On-GCD abilities 0.1124 seconds sooner after casting than the Crit/Det build (also allows slightly faster dodging).
+ Crit/Det build will return an average of 43.239 more HP per cure than the SS build.

Technically there's also a slight edge to the Crit/Det build in terms of MP consumption (curing for slightly more HP slightly less often will eat less MP!)

It should be noted that SCH's mechanics make Crit stacking a VASTLY more straightforward choice; due to the Adloquium/Enhanced Pet Action bonuses, more regular Instantcast heals, and the fact that SCH has much more "proactive" mitigation such as shields/buffs compared to WHM's "reactive" spike healing.

[kukurumei]

Depends on the situation...

A Tank getting hit for ~2200 HP per hit might need 2 cures to completely top them up on a Det/Crit build but 3 on a SS build.
Do they NEED to be completely topped up? Depends on the fight and what's coming next.

Likewise, a Tank getting hit for ~700 HP per hit might need only one cure from either build to top them up, but the SS build would be able to top them up slightly more regularly.
Do they NEED to be topped up more regularly? Depends on how fast the next hit is coming.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

A comparison of a WHM BIS SS build compared to a WHM BIS Crit/Det build is actually quite simple:

(1) BIS Crit/Det build (on my char, Seawolf): 513 MND, 436 Crit, 296 Det
Crit Adjusted Healing = 1152.654 HP recovered per Cure
SS is 391, giving a GCD of 2.450s (normal) or 2.077s under Presence of Mind.

(2) BIS SS build (on my char, Seawolf): 513 MND, 388 Crit, 235 Det
Crit Adjusted Healing = 1109.415 HP recovered per Cure
SS is 509, giving a GCD of 2.337s (normal) or 1.853s under Presence of Mind.


Difference in Raw Healing output per Cure: 3.751% in favour of the Crit/Det.
Difference in Cure Casting Speed: 4.588% in favour of the SS build.

This means that a tank can survive taking slightly heavier spikes of damage with the Det/Crit build (each cure landing heals for more), but they can survive taking slightly faster consecutive hits with the SS build (cures land more regularly).


Time until the SS build gets an extra cast: 21 GCDs (51.45 seconds)

This means that a SS build will become able to heal more average HP over time than a Det/Crit build after just under a minute of uninterrupted casting. Unfortunately due to movement mechanics and few on-GCD WHM spells being instantcast, this will not apply to many endgame situations.

- - - - - - - - - -

TL;DR:
+ SS build will be better than the Crit/Det build after 51.45 seconds of continual on-GCD casting
+ SS build will be be able to land On-GCD abilities 0.1124 seconds sooner after casting than the Crit/Det build (also allows slightly faster dodging).
+ Crit/Det build will return an average of 43.239 more HP per cure than the SS build.

Technically there's also a slight edge to the Crit/Det build in terms of MP consumption (curing for slightly more HP slightly less often will eat less MP!)

It should be noted that SCH's mechanics make Crit stacking a VASTLY more straightforward choice; due to the Adloquium/Enhanced Pet Action bonuses, more regular Instantcast heals, and the fact that SCH has much more "proactive" mitigation such as shields/buffs compared to WHM's "reactive" spike healing.

Well the crit bonus is pretty minor, and vastly unattainable other then an epeen, since critting when you need it to crit is pretty rare. Crit is more for succor where you are rngX8 as a sch which vastly improves the crit stat.

And it really depends on the precast timeline of a Whm. In that does SS make a difference in that even if a whm tries to pre-cast cure2, does the SS make/break the pre-cast.

If a whm can transition from one cure (medica 2 say on fireball) to cure2 precast (of say the DS landing). Then SS is more or less pointless.

But the argument has been that over curing is just going to at best do nothing and at worse kill the whm, then might as well get SS where the most advantage lies.

If you a whm DS, crit a war with cure 2, on top of a det build, you may get like 3.5k off of that. That's a shit load megaton of overcure there and potential turn and get their head bitten off.

[Maelwys]

If you a whm DS, crit a war with cure 2, on top of a det build, you may get like 3.5k off of that. That's a shit load megaton of overcure there and potential turn and get their head bitten off.

You can make exactly the same enmity argument about SS builds, because under optimal conditions they'll be healing for roughly the same amount over time as the Crit/Det builds.

The problem with the overhealing enmity argument is that it doesn't really apply anymore since patch 2.1; unless either the healer or the tank is very, very bad.

Cure II is 650 potency. A Crit Cure II is 975 Potency.

Healing pulls half the enmity of damage. In terms of raw enmity potency; a Paladin or a Warrior can counteract that with a single, uncomboed Butcher's Block or Rage of Halone; both of which grant 100*5=500 enmity, whilst NOT EVEN IN THEIR TANKING STANCE. The only time a Crit Cure II should pull major hate is less than 5 seconds into a fight... and really, the Healer should know better than to use Cure II so early. 3.5k worth of healing translates to a RoH/BB hit of less than 200 damage for a Tank in their +Enmity stance. These days a decent Tank can hold hate even over sustained Medica spam.

Again, the main difference between the builds boils down to more healing per cure or less time between cures. Neither build will be operating optimally all the time: sometimes you'll be forced to overheal, sometimes you'll be forced to wait longer between casts.