Out of ideas

[ShadeUK]

Im out of ideas.....

I've never ever had any lag or delays on any other game until this 1, i just dont get it. How can it be my ISP when every other game works fine without issues? This game is appalling in stability ,im not sure what to do anymore to do with the connection.

Hopefully this gets resolved because im another sub that is going to leave if it doesnt.

Anyone have any other ideas on this stupid lag and delay crap?

[Ma_Ge]

...and I'm sick of it. Thinking I'll give them until its time to pay for another month. Not fixed by then, I'm done.

[Izawwlgood]

Launcher issue? I'm having the same!

[Sandoria]

This guy hit the nail on the head of home's problem.

Hey DP Yeah this issue doesn't always happen to everyone all the time but it is definitely an issue with the route to the SE server. Use this http://www.pingplotter.com/ and download ping plotter. Then enter 199.91.189.57 in the bar in the upper right hand corner when you start the program. That is the IP address for Hyperion. change the interval to a smaller number and increase how many data points are on the plot. Then just sit back and watch the route your computer takes to get to the SE servers in Montreal. It will show you if there is packet loss along the way and at which node it happens at. This is a problem effecting a lot of people. SE is still twiddling their thumbs in their butt holes on this problem. But most people have an issue with Level3 nodes on the way to the server and the server itself. SE has to call for the gamers and get level3 and the other people in the area to fix the issue. Level3 will not talk to consumers of other ISP's so there is really nothing we can do about it. The first 3-4 jumps will be your local region ISP if there is no issues in that region then there is nothing you can do to fix the issue yourself. Best regards and see you online in the LS

We're not on the Hyperion server but we still have packet loss at Montreal and with that- extreme lag every night. I love this game and don't want to give up on it. At the same time, it's not fair I can't see end game content at all because of consistent and extreme lag that I can't do anything about. I hope SE does SOMETHING, anything really before we just give up hope and move on to other games.

[ShadeUK]

Hopefully tomorrows maintenance will solve atleast most of them. But somehow i doubt it will because the only reason they probably doing tomorrow's update is because the PS4 version comes out soon. Even though the current is unstable and lag infested.

This is the annoying thing.

209.130.141.243 ===== bytes=32 time= 35ms TTL=55
209.130.141.243 ===== bytes=32 time= 34ms TTL=55
209.130.141.243 ===== bytes=32 time= 33ms TTL=55
209.130.141.243 ===== bytes=32 time= 34ms TTL=55

Packets sent = 4 Packets Recieved = 4 0% Packet Loss

Minimum = 33ms
Maximum = 35ms
Average = 34ms

Thats a ping test from my CMD to their EU Servers that i did the other day. In theory it should be perfectly playable but its not at all on any level. Its just delayed to hell. Even forwarded their ports and no difference.

Its sucks really ive always enjoyed FF all my life and this is just ruining it now.

I guess all we can do is hope they fix it. Since its nothing any of us can do.

[Raist]

Specific content is buggered primarily because the servers hosting content can't handle the load too well, and that is getting further compounded by documented routing issues across North America. The pending maintenance should be addressing this in part by <hopefully> alleviating some of the server side congestion issues... but we still have transmission problems at the ISP levels that need addressing.

There is still an issue with many people's routing. Depending on just where the problems are occurring in each specific route, such problems actually fall to those user's ISP to address, which is why SE keeps sloughing it off to them. Your ISP negotiates with other carriers for access to their routes to get you to Montreal to get on SE's ISP's lines. If the problem occurs between your ISP's segments and SE's ISP's segments, then it falls to your ISP to enforce their quality of service agreement with those partners.

SE really has no influence here. Now, if it is happening within Ormuco's segments or SE's internal network, that's a different story. But, if it's a congestion issue at level3, cogentco, TATA, i-WEB, etc. that your ISP has commissioned to carry your data to Montreal--then your ISP needs to get involved to either lean on them to fix the issue, purchase a fatter pipe from them, or route you to a different partner that can better handle the load. Plain and simple--it is an issue with the routing your ISP has negotiated based on their and their partner's analytics that is putting you on a bad path to Montreal.

Think of it like a popular GPS system that keeps sending everyone down the same highways. Something happens to cause a major traffic jam. That GPS system needs to be notified of the impeded traffic flow and begin routing people to an alternate route. If that system does not get those notifications or otherwise does not adjust to move people away from the now congested route, everyone using that GPS system to get to the same location may get stuck in that traffic jam. For whatever reason, the mechanisms put in place with our routing is not kicking in like it should to do just that--we need to let them know. Once they have been notified, it is up to them to resolve our congested routing--NOT SE. The problem is, many people are only in contact with tier1 or tier2 people that can only look at and address localized issues.

In most cases, this is much deeper than a localized problem, so it needs to be addressed by tier3 people and possibly escalated to even higher departments to address peering/exchange/transit agreements for a proper resolution. Don't accept the "reboot your modem/router" and "your connection/signal looks fine" as an answer from your ISP. The problem is typically not at this localized level... you need to push the issue further into tier3 territory, as it is NOT isolated to just SE's servers. It has been reported for multiple games and services--it has affected Netflix and even access to Google content. It is a deeply rooted systemic problem with specific ISP's, and the only way to get it addressed is for their paying customers to push for the changes (be that you to your ISP, or your ISP to their partners). Go check out your ISP's own forums if you don't believe me. TWC's forums are LITTERED with complaints at the moment... and it is NOT just for FFXIV.
http://forums.timewarnercable.com/t5...p/connectivity

Case in point, we've been dealing with TWC to work on our routing issues, and the results have improved dramatically. Aside from a recent issue that has cropped up specific to the RR gateways we use locally, they have managed to get us set up with a pretty clean route now from my area:

Tracing route to 199.91.189.25 over a maximum of 30 hops

  1     2 ms    <1 ms     1 ms  LPTSRV [10.10.100.1]
  2   296 ms    65 ms    25 ms  cpe-098-025-064-001.sc.res.rr.com [98.25.64.1]
  3    11 ms    11 ms    17 ms  cpe-024-031-198-005.sc.res.rr.com [24.31.198.5]
  4    33 ms    30 ms    24 ms  xe-7-0-0.rlghncpop-rtr1.southeast.rr.com [24.93.64.40]
  5    33 ms    34 ms    32 ms  107.14.19.44
  6    28 ms    40 ms    30 ms  ae-2-0.pr0.dca10.tbone.rr.com [66.109.6.169]
  7    33 ms    43 ms    35 ms  te0-16-0-23.ccr41.iad02.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.10.209]
  8    36 ms    32 ms    34 ms  be2177.ccr22.dca01.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.41.206]
  9    45 ms    42 ms    44 ms  be2148.ccr21.jfk02.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.31.118]
 10    42 ms    43 ms    61 ms  be2106.ccr21.alb02.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.3.50]
 11    66 ms    67 ms    71 ms  be2088.ccr21.ymq02.atlas.cogentco.com [154.54.43.17]
 12    62 ms    61 ms    60 ms  38.122.42.34
 13    46 ms    45 ms    46 ms  192.34.76.10
 14    42 ms    43 ms    43 ms  199.91.189.242
 15    43 ms    44 ms    46 ms  199.91.189.25

Trace complete.

This is from Florence, SC... during prime-time. I can ping SE's servers for 50-80 ms response times all day until the RR gateways get overloaded, then it starts breaking 100ms and goes to crap. The problem comes into play because of an issue with the Time Warner/Road Runner lines... the first ones in the route.

The ONLY time I have issues with my connection now in the general world areas now is when that first gateway gets flakey (which it is on the cusp of doing now, as we just hit primetime). Instanced content still has a bit of a problem even when my conx is good, and SE needs to address their load issues there--but as for the normal world environment, normal quests, FATES and such, gameplay is good so long as the RR gateway is in good shape. It is only when 98.25.64.1 starts hitting the 400+ mark, I start seeing the lag spikes in the the general game environment, and then everything begins to become unmanageable. Right now, the only time instanced content becomes unplayable for me is when my local gateways go to crap. The rest of the route is essentially fine---it's all because our local segments have been oversold. Still waiting to hear back from Tier3 support on that issue... but otherwise, they've managed to work this out on their own somehow.

Again... this was done by working with my ISP, not SE. TWC may have been in contact with them, but I haven't.

Granted, instanced content is a mixed bag with issues on both side of the equation. SE has issues that they need to address (hopefully this maintenance will help considerably), but they are getting compounded by our routing issues. If we get the routing cleaned up, the server side lag may be much more manageable. So, if you are having issues with the normal game environment lagging, you definitely need to lean really hard on your ISP's tier3 support to investigate your specific route and address any issues found on their segments or within their partners segments. Having a tracert to your specific server will help tremendously with that effort. IF it is isolated more to your instanced content, may help if you can identify the server address being used and get a trace to that server for submission. I once caught the .31 IP in use during a duty (I use .74 for lobby and .25 for the world), and also included a problematic trace to that server in one of my reports to TWC. Since I began working with them on this, they have been bouncing my route all over the place... but this current route seems to be holding up.

Now, if I could just get them to split us off of that flaky 98.25.64.1 and onto a better gateway...

Edit:
sorry.. didn't mean to go off on a rant there... but everyone keeps sitting around waiting on SE, complaining to the players about their problems. This isn't a support line to SE by the way... it is user to user support. Read the sticky welcoming you to the Tech Support Forum for an explanation. There are things we actually can do about a large part of our problems... just need people to become a little more proactive.

TLDR: DEMAND your ISP escalate your problem to tier3 or higher--there are documented problems in our routes THEY are responsible for addressing

There are documented routing issues that your ISP is contractually obligated to address. They have the power to do this, and some have actually managed to get it addressed and seen dramatic improvement in quality of gameplay-- to a point. There are still some issues SE needs to address on their instance servers, but even with those problems it can be managed for a large portion of content if your ISP cleans it up.

These problems reside deep in the networks, typically with their routing partners and the local guys that answer the phone and the technicians that come on-site cannot address these issues. You need to push further up the support chain (ask for tier3 support, supervisors, etc.) to get them to take a closer look. Getting an email address so you can send traces clearly showing the signs of congestion (lag spikes and timeouts along the route) will help demonstrate where they need to look.

We need to lean on our providers to get our connections cleaned up. After that is fixed and proven not to be a problem--the rest is squarely on SE to address. Until then, the guys on both sides are going to continue to blame the other because they are both at fault until one of them fixes their sh!t. We may not be able to push SE much on that end... but we can lean on our ISP's. Worst case scenario, we can threaten to move to a competitor (provided we have options in our area).

[Sandoria]

Thank you for this post Raist. It's the first one I've seen personally where someone's approached the ISP and gotten somewhere. I also have TWC and being that I'm not super tech savvy, I've been reluctant to call. It feels even more self defeating to make that call when you read all these threads of people saying that no one at tier 3 would even talk to them. You called and got somewhere and are seeing a difference. Means there IS something I can do and there is the possibility this can be fixed. This is exactly what I needed and I'm really glad you took the time to write it out. Thank you, truly.

[RealSurprise]

SE games are unplayable in the America's, because SE will not follow their protocols, and the customers have to do all the dirty work for them by telling our ISP to follow SE's protocol?!? Seems like a lot of work for me, for something I am already paying for.

[Raist]

SE games are unplayable in the America's, because SE will not follow their protocols, and the customers have to do all the dirty work for them by telling our ISP to follow SE's protocol?!? Seems like a lot of work for me, for something I am already paying for.

Not sure what you are referring to in reference to "protocols".... this is a documented, systemic problem within the networks of our ISP's and the ISP's they have partnered with. It is NOT isolated to just FFXIV either--LoL, WoW, GW2, Twitch, JustinTV, Yahoo, Google (and by extension, YouTube), Netflix, PSN, XBL... just a handful I can fire off the top of my head that have all been impacted. THis is something your ISP is responsible for maintaining, or at the very least responsible for reporting to their partners and pushing them to address.

SE has no obligation to address your internet connectivity issues--they are responsible for your access pass, their internal network and servers, the content hosted on those servers , your game client and personal data bound to the services bound to it, and their own internet connection agreements with Ormuco. That's pretty much it. Your ISP has both the means and the obligation to address problems with the INTERNET SERVICE YOU PAY THEM TO MAINTAIN. Pure and simple. A TWC problem is a TWC problem, and not SE's. Perhaps this may help put it in better perspective:



bah.. this site won't take the scripting to make it interactive, but it does update periodically with a page reload (it just got worse after I made an edit). The interactive map is available here:
http://downdetector.com/status/time-warner-cable/map/
**Note that this is just for TWC, it doesn't show AT&T, Comcast, etc.---these are issues for just ONE ISP in the US.

How is SE responsible for resolving internet transmission problems being reported to TWC in New York, Paterson, Austin, Brooklyn, Houston, Buffalo, Arlington, Watertown, Los Angeles, and San Antonio?

That's right... that falls to TWC to investigate and address on behalf of their paying customers.

There are on-going issues at some major exchange points. For instance, Southern California can adversely impact a large portion of the Oceania region because their ISP's undersea lines feed through there. The northern mid-west corridor can affect a crap-ton of people because of the forced NSA scans being done there. Northeast can affect EU players. Atlanta, Charlotte, Raleigh exchange points can feed into the DC/Ashburne corridor--effectively the whole South East can be choked off by 3 trunks in that region.

Note also that like the South Pacific entry points into North America, there are a limited number of entry points into Canada. Keep in mind also that this game recently got a big shot in the arm for subscriptions (big half-off sale, promises of new/adjusted content), compounding problems with an already congested pipeline into Canada.

This is something SE has no control over, much less any influence. But, your ISP has influence as a paying customer to the third parties that maintain those lines/exchange points, and they have an obligation to assist you in addressing these problems since you are their paying customer.

[ShadeUK]

I find it hard to believe its ISP's more than SE , since most of the people with problems dont have a single issue with anything else, this is the only game that is causing issue for said players. Not a single other game does.