Rant,Rambling and Drivel: Is it Fun Yet?!

[Royze]

I believe that Yoshida's approach towards hard content needs some serious revision.
This is a game meant to entertain and create feelings of pleasure within the player/customer. I believe this fundamental fact has been ignored or at the very least, not emphasized on enough. "Fun" in itself is too subjective a term to use here. As such I have used terms like "pleasure" or "enjoyment". (One's pleasure can be another's torture and vice-versa) but both will express the desire to have more of whatever it is that causes them to experience pleasure - to an extent, that is.

I believe FFXIV is set up purely to milk us of our time and money, while not living up to its part of the transaction - pleasure. We aren't actually getting anything in return other than the expulsion of our money and our time.

I will take a moment to explain how I came to this conclusion and would welcome someone to challenge it constructively.

Things I find pleasurable in an MMO (all of you will agree at least on one, many will agree on more)
1. Community - We are social beings. The more tied together the community is, the greater the mystery and potential for interesting relationships and economies to develop. Fragmented communities are not the same. A good MMO nurtures communities and puts in places devices to encourage and even reward it.

What we have to work with:
- Freecompanies that can host hundreds of players. +1
- Instances and gameplay that supports at most 8 individuals doing things together consistently and a statement by Yoshida that this is how end game will continue to be. -100
why?

First for not recognizing that inclusion is better than exclusion. In a Massive Multiplayer Online game, chances are the unique selling point is the large number of people you have access to in your adventures. FFXIV has been Marketed and built to be an MMO, yet if you really look at what it is, it is a LAN network game with a public lobby. The only times it mimics an MMO are the worst of experiences in the game (fates/odin/behemoth and CT)

Second for not learning anything from 12 years of FFXI.(I'm not saying turn XIV into XI. But to ignore the past is to condemn the future.)
All true large man content was successful in XI, and other MMO's as well. Einherjar, Dynamis, Sky, Sea and Limbus. Flagship epic events that were popular and in high demand. What in XIV do we have that resembles any of them? The state of XIV is so bad at the moment that if we were given an event like Beseiged or Campaign, it would easily trump anything else in popularity. While being a time sink, they would still be active time sinks in a social setting. We have NOTHING like that now.

Third, Housing. Great Concept. Great potential. None of it realized. We have more buildings essentially. What we were expecting was a permanent hang out with perks. There are no Perks. You can't afk there without being dc'd, you don't get any bonuses, you just met SE's expectations of dumping your gil into something that allowed them to curb inflation. But you got nothing in return except bragging rights. And even those are temporary. In summary we thought, expected and hoped housing would allow for more community development. Market boards won't cut it. And honestly, that's an insult to us all. At the very least, remove forced disconnects within the housing wards. Its a perk.

Continued aspects of MMO's that I find enjoyable:

2. Intuitive gameplay and obstacles that challenge my own knowledge and intellect and allow me to leverage who I am and the skills/gear I have acquired, in a virtual setting.

Again, going to have to reference XI. We had skillchains that required not just knowledge of our skills, but that of others. Working together and coordinating attacks resulted in an effect being greater than the sum of two. We could also top it off for more benefits with Magic Bursts.
We had elemental strengths and weaknesses. A monster correlation system. All of the above intertwined into the lore and realm. There's a lot more like weather/days weapon types, enfeebling effects that I won't go into.

What do we actually have in XIV:
- Dodge ball/"don't get hit by the flashing red lines" and "just do your own thing".
- Spam the same skills in the same pattern regardless of what you are fighting.
Or in other words "READ FROM THE SCRIPT AND QUE CARDS, IDIOTS".

Moving along now,
3. Progression combined with holistic and consistent content, that comes together collectively and seamlessly. As you develop, the realm develops.

They could have made current endgame instances reward you with drops while also not rendering each other obsolete. Extreme lack of foresight here.
What do we actually have in XIV:
-Get your AF gear for ... lols? Its ok, getting it is a lol in itself.
-Spam a couple of dungeons that drop redundant gear no one ever uses to build Philosophy points to get DL gear that people will use for a couple of days, while at the same time getting mythology tomes/points for end game gear.
(Wait what? The mother of all F___k UPS! Who developed this reward system?)
Wait_ it gets better)
Release an instance that drops superior gear to everything called coil. Then release another instance called Crystal tower that drops inferior gear to coil but better than DL but not as good as Mythology gear.
WAIT WHAT?! SQUARE ENIX IS TROLLING RIGHT?
Wrong. This is just another instance of their confused strategy for this game.

So, why is SE confused?
I thought about this, and read a lot of posts with a lot of different valid opinions that made a lot of sense. But then I realized they made sense. And SE doesn't. Thus deducing that all previous rationalizations were wrong except for that one guy who claimed "LOL SE dunno wtf they're doing".
SE never thought past launch date. All the time FFXIV was down, the development team were working on Titan and other gimmicks. There never was a strategy. Just gimmicks. This entire game is a gimmick. There never was a journey being planned and carefully written, it was an instance, disconnected from everything else. The entire game is disconnected from itself. Open world gameplay? No, this is an online browser of pretty landscapes. Teleport from anywhere to anywhere in no time. Millions of subscribers online?Who cares you only need to know 7. "Crafting" - craft stuff no one wants, or buys. SE will make sure of it.



4. Challenges that although programmed to be a certain way, seem spontaneous and allow one to forget the algorithms and AI that is the adversary.

What we actually have:
No one really needs to know anything other than switch the tanks at certain times, dodge the red stuff on the floor, avoid plumes, don't fall. Learn the pattern by making a rhyme or a jingle out of the sequence of attacks. "Get on TS/Vent/Mumble/Raidcall if you suck and I'll tell you what attack is coming next"
All you need is to memorize basic sequences and people will consider you a prophet.
"Double Weight of the land next"
"Dude I love you, I never beat titan before. yay!"
"I'm a special snowflake, bow down"


Skill - noun

1. the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude, etc., to do something well: Carpentry was one of his many skills.

2.competent excellence in performance; expertness; dexterity: The dancers performed with skill.

3.a craft, trade, or job requiring manual dexterity or special training in which a person has competence and experience: the skill of cabinetmaking.

4.Obsolete . understanding; discernment.

5.Obsolete . reason; cause.

Synonyms
1. proficiency, facility. 2. deftness, cleverness.

I don't believe in absolutes. So terms like "skilled player" go out the window for me.
Skilled BLM or Tank, on the other hand, are agreeable to me.
For one can be an exceptionally skilled Tank, and at the same time an exceptionally horrible WHM or DPS. Inverse also being true.

Many times, I think when people want to use the word skill, they actually mean "gifted".

Taking the above definition into account, skill is something that is developed and gained over time. Through practice and the acquisition of knowledge. Repetition being the key. In short, enough practice and retention of the right knowledge equates to skill when it is deployed and executed efficiently.

Take Titan Extreme for example: Skilled play is derived from practice and learning the patterns. Done enough times, the fight becomes predictable and sequential. If you practice it enough, it becomes habitual and second nature. Skill in Titan Ex, grows and increases in a linear fashion. The more you do it, the more proficient you become.

And yet, the more often you do anything, the less pleasurable it becomes. On the contrary, it starts to become painful. Frustration

[Cspr_Answrth]

You don't find pleasure in playing, so why not go do something else?
I guess I don't really understand the logic here.

[KrenianKandos]

I kinda stopped after the first point because I just want to state the counter-argument to your thesis:

The idea of 'fun' differs from player to player, as different factors are set for 'fun' for players. What you believe is fun for you isn't necessarily the same for someone else. I'm quite comfy with my group of players I play with which are no more than 8 players, and I don't need to be in a group of 100 people to down a boss, so long as I feel like I'm having fun with the players I am with.

So in the end, your entire point is more of an opinion base than an argument and cannot be held up solely because it's based on a bias.

Sorry, I rather just not go into a "my opinion is better than yours" debate. They tend to turn into bitchfests.

[Aethaeryn]

So in the end, your entire point is more of an opinion base than an argument and cannot be held up solely because it's based on a bias.

Sorry, I rather just not go into a "my opinion is better than yours" debate. They tend to turn into bitchfests.

Except he flat out says "Things I find pleasurable in an MMO" and goes on to explain each thing and what's lacking in this game for him. He should have left out the part about how everyone would agree with at least one, as that's likely not the case, but I certainly didn't feel like he was trying to speak for everyone with this post. Maybe you missed that bit due to horrible formatting. General forum is filled with people stating their opinions on what they feel needs to be changed to keep people around. Also, he titled the thread "Rant,Rambling and Drivel"

[KrenianKandos]

Except he flat out says "Things I find pleasurable in an MMO" and goes on to explain each thing and what's lacking in this game for him. He should have left out the part about how everyone would agree with at least one, as that's likely not the case, but I certainly didn't feel like he was trying to speak for everyone with this post. Maybe you missed that bit due to horrible formatting. General forum is filled with people stating their opinions on what they feel needs to be changed to keep people around. Also, he titled the thread "Rant,Rambling and Drivel"

Possible. I read the title quickly and came in but the way the structure of the argument was done felt like "THIS IS HOW IT HAS TO BE OTHERWISE THIS GAME WILL FAIL".



I don't like those kinds of post because it is one of those "I speak for everyone" type. I got that off within the first two paragraphs so that's why I sounded off on it.

Having read his reply down in page 2 and stating that it was really a rant of his frustrations, I can come in here with a different perspective. The way it was written felt like a dissertation of what is fun. As soon as someone throws the definition of a word in a thesis-like write up, I tend to throw red flags right away.

Sorry for the lack of proper structure in my OP. It was actually a rant and I titled it so to not mislead anyone. I just typed out all my frustrations in one go and didn't even bother reading over it.

I can respect that when you come out and pretty much state it was a rant and can comment by only saying that it may just not be the game itself but the genre as most MMOs tend to go towards the FFXIV route lately and I don't see any shining moment further down the road. No MMOs that are upcoming reflect some of the ideas you posted and it's a shame (having years of MMOs, I can certainly understand where you're coming from), but it's at that point where you have to let it run off into the sunset and then re-evaluate your desires to play an MMO as it is in its current incarnation.

Sad to say but the MMOs of the past with open world conflict and time-consuming content are long gone. You'll mostly see MMOs that come out and go with the "you can do stuff in an hour if you want" deal.

[Tiggy]

Subjective argument is subjective!

[Karnyboy]

I'm having fun even if I'm not a fan of certain progression styles in the game

[TheUltimate3]

So...what would you suggest?

[Swishytail]

I have found myself playing significantly less as of late, mainly due to the OP's reasons. No, I don't expect the game to be
perfect, or cater to me specifically. I've played MMO's for a very long time, I know how it goes. I will say, however, a game
like FFXI for example had a certain "thing", or a hook if you will, that kept me playing for 8 years. It's hard to explain, but with
XI I couldn't wait to get off work/out of school/whatever and rush home and log in.


I honestly cannot explain why exactly. It just felt more... open, fun, accomplishing, challenging. I'm to the point in this game already
to where it feels more like a job, or that I am forcing myself to log in. I know people are gonna say "Well then quit." I've considered,
and I have been playing other games. Not MMO's, console. I want to see this game succeed so bad because I've been a fan of Final
Fantasy since FF1. I've played every single one multiple times.

I'm not writing this to necessarily bash the game, or say it's crap, or "Go play XXXX it's better!!!111". I just know what the OP feels
in his post. There are a lot of things that could be tweaked. Will they? Who knows. Obviously this is an extremely subjective matter,
and not everyone is going to feel the same.

Anyhow, that's just my two cents. I promised myself at minimum 1 expansion, so we'll see what happens.

[Skies]

I have found myself playing significantly less as of late, mainly due to the OP's reasons. No, I don't expect the game to be perfect, or cater to me specifically. I've played MMO's for a very long time, I know how it goes. I will say, however, a game like FFXI for example had a certain "thing", or a hook if you will, that kept me playing for 8 years. It's hard to explain, but with XI I couldn't wait to get off work/out of school/whatever and rush home and log in.

That is called "Time Required". In a game where you need to keep up with your friends and in which doing anything at all requires vast amounts of time either preparing for it or repeating content endlessly in order to acquire something, you feel pressured to not waste even a moment of your time doing anything else other than working for that one particular goal that will take forever to accomplish. Whereas if you know you will get there even if you slow down a little you will certainly take your time to play another, spout idleness at your friends or finish your homework.