Is there an unneeded hostility towards regular classes in this game?

[Huntington]

As someone that liked ACN and has built an i86 gear set to try out the possibilities of adventuring with Carbuncle, I can definitely relate to the want to try raids/instances as ACN instead of SMN. Having said that, you are extremely gimping dps. I've tried since creating my i90 ACN post and the dps, which I can confirm now, is at least 15% lower.

However, I don't think that is enough of a reason to get kicked from CT or other DF related raids/instances. Since ACN is a class choice for queuing, and you can que so long as you meet mandatory ilvl requirements, then your group should be fine with your involvement in the party. But, I am betting there is more to this story since you were indeed kicked from a CT raid... probably not doing something right such as pulling bosses early, or wiping the raid by not doing your role properly.

In that one Raid's case, none of the above. Joined on the Vassago part, they wiped because it was going badly which is why there was a space for me, and I joined, then started it anew. Did my thing for the fight, there were no issues, I didn't go down, or anything like that. Soon as the fight ends and we move on to Behemoth, I got to the top of the steps and got kicked five seconds later. No one said anything, no one even looked at me. I just got booted for no literal reason. I implore people to kick me if I know I can't make any sort of a difference incase I don't know a fight or am geared horribly, level 30 gear in CT for example, but this was one case of Class Elitism in a Raid that is not all that difficult when everyone knows what to do. Everyone could in each 8 man party do the fight on Classes if they wanted to, and I saw a video someone posted of a "Marauder DPS class" the other day. They stayed at range and just threw buffed Tomahawks the entire time. There were people that laughed, then other's that got pissed off at them. They did not get booted for literally messing around and doing less damage though, they stayed in every raid they participated in the OP said in a later post I believe. Yet I could go in and do my Role very well, not cause undue problems and still participate, and I got booted for nothing.

There are obvious times when I can say where I made a mistake in my playing, that was not one of them.

[Ardan]

There are obvious times when I can say where I made a mistake in my playing, that was not one of them.

You're making a mistake continuing to post on these forums. You've been told you're wrong about ACN. You asked for advice, advice was given and now you're having a tantrum. ACN is not welcome in endgame content, end of story. In the kinder way to put it:

[Huntington]

You're making a mistake continuing to post on these forums. You've been told you're wrong about ACN. You asked for advice, advice was given and now you're having a tantrum. ACN is not welcome in endgame content, end of story. In the kinder way to put it:

That was in a completely unrelated situation what you quoted, did you read for coherency or not? What part of anything now says tantrum? I don't care about anything that happened before that 3rd/4th page marker, I'm not screaming at anyone in all caps or using overt amounts of exclamation marks, and never have been. If you want to think I'm pulling a tantrum find some actual evidence that says so.

As for you, don't post if you have nothing constructive or useful to add, memes are not an addition to anything.

[Maku]

I saw a video someone posted of a "Marauder DPS class" the other day. They stayed at range and just threw buffed Tomahawks the entire time. There were people that laughed, then other's that got pissed off at them. They did not get booted for literally messing around and doing less damage though, they stayed in every raid they participated in the OP said in a later post I believe. Yet I could go in and do my Role very well, not cause undue problems and still participate, and I got booted for nothing.

That MRD was surprised he didn't get booted though. If you read the whole thread he states that many times. He probably didn't get booted though because he kept talking about being a "Ranged DPS" and such and people knew full well that he was "trolling"/ having a go and just fn off. Your group that kicked your probably thought one of two things. Either, A) This guy made a mistake when he qued get rid of him. or B) This guy is serious that he thinks ACN is useful in Endgame, kick him.

I am going to go with the A option cause I like to think the best of people but B is more than likely what happened.

[Huntington]

That MRD was surprised he didn't get booted though. If you read the whole thread he states that many times. He probably didn't get booted though because he kept talking about being a "Ranged DPS" and such and people knew full well that he was "trolling"/ having a go and just fn off. Your group that kicked your probably thought one of two things. Either, A) This guy made a mistake when he qued get rid of him. or B) This guy is serious that he thinks ACN is useful in Endgame, kick him.

I am going to go with the A option cause I like to think the best of people but B is more than likely what happened.

Someone should quote me on where I've said that I think I can use ACN in the Extreme fights and Twintania then. Crystal Tower is easy as heck and should not be seen as part of endgame difficulty when other Duty missions represent it better. When was asking people to leave so hard that we immediately jump to kicking for unjust reasons?

[Menriq]

Someone should quote me on where I've said that I think I can use ACN in the Extreme fights and Twintania then. Crystal Tower is easy as heck and should not be seen as part of endgame difficulty when other Duty missions represent it better. When was asking people to leave so hard that we immediately jump to kicking for unjust reasons?

I can only form an opinion based on what I've read here. Looking at this objectively, I think a reasonable assumption would that be that if the group asked you to leave based on you being an Arcanist over a Summoner, you would not have simply said "Ok" and left. My opinion, again only gathered by what I have read here, is that you would have engaged them on why you felt Arcanist was fine. One could also come to the conclusion that one end result would have been them removing you from the group via kick. Perhaps they jumped the gun, but I can see tolerance of a Tank / Healer "trolling" being higher since it's much easier to replace a "troll" DPS. Note, this is not to insinuate that you were trolling. However, I can see a point of view where the group could have felt you were trolling.

[Huntington]

I can only form an opinion based on what I've read here. Looking at this objectively, I think a reasonable assumption would that be that if the group asked you to leave based on you being an Arcanist over a Summoner, you would not have simply said "Ok" and left. My opinion, again only gathered by what I have read here, is that you would have engaged them on why you felt Arcanist was fine. One could also come to the conclusion that one end result would have been them removing you from the group via kick. Perhaps they jumped the gun, but I can see tolerance of a Tank / Healer "trolling" being higher since it's much easier to replace a "troll" DPS. Note, this is not to insinuate that you were trolling. However, I can see a point of view where the group could have felt you were trolling.

Depending on what Duty I'm in, I would do the first. Excluding the Hard Mode dungeons like Haukke Manor, Copperbell Mines HM, Pharos Sirius, Extreme Fights, Coil T1 through 5, and whatever else I might be forgetting. Otherwise, I would put forth a reasonable response on why it can work with what we have, or what I have. I've tried to form it as best I can stat wise so that it's only outmatched by SMN by a tad, there will be places where I can recognize that nothing short of my best will be enough, for those I ask to be kicked so I don't incur a penalty and they can get someone else.

As for the Healer and Tank tolerance, it makes sense. In a lot of Instances, if the Tank or a Healer quits, you almost never find a replacement based on hundreds of runs on Shiva, once that happens it's just better to abandon.

[xEscaflownex]

I've tried to form it as best I can stat wise so that it's only outmatched by SMN by a tad

18% + is not a tad, especially over the course of any boss fight, it's tens of thousands of damage.

[Ryuko]

I just got booted for no literal reason.

You were booted because you willingly gimped your dps by playing as Arcanist instead of Summoner. End of story. Perhaps you were given the boot ahead of the other people you mentioned because they can see your class instantly in the party list and thus you were easier to discern than a useless person just throwing things from far away. If I had to guess, people assumed you hadn't even unlocked summoner (otherwise why WOULD you be playing arcanist!?) and booted you because they assumed you knew next to nothing about the game, and would likely weigh the party down.

I'll say it in a nicer way than others, but I agree it is time for you to stop posting. You have your answers, and while I empathize that you want to think outside of the box (creatively), it just isn't viable... and I said this more than once. Now you are just fueling the fire and I think people are getting frustrated with the fact that you just aren't listening to reason or evidence.

[Sigred]

I think people are getting frustrated with the fact that you just aren't listening to reason or evidence.

When someone does not listen to reason, there is no evidence you can show that will convince them that they should.