How to make tanks more fun to play (devs please read)

[Meshico]

As a wimpy DD that pulls hate from people that spam Rage of Halone/Butchers Block...use combo's.

Aria Mihgo...Please tell me you actually do use Combo's.

If you don't its your choice and i won't bog you down...just, just tell me you combo ( even if its a lie )

[Aria_Mihgo]

As someone who was trying to point out that after 9 seconds, spamming RoH never draws more enmity than the combo.... duh? (Yes. Of course I use the combo.)

[Aria_Mihgo]

Yep, I don't get why you can't just run to where the mob is beating on the DPS (especially if it were a melee that was pulling hate).
So let's say the boss "takes off" within the first 6 seconds to chase a ranged DPS ... you run after it and continue your combo, then move it back into place.

Also BLM can take 2 hits with Manawall, or reduce their enmity generation with quelling strikes, BRD can also use quelling strikes.
So let the overzealous DPS (especially if they really are i90) tank for a second or two. It probably won't kill them, and if it did, maybe they shouldn't be pulling so much hate from the get go.

[Aria_Mihgo]

To the OTHER enemy? I thought you were talking about boss fights for the main story run?
Are you just talking about holding all the hate on all the mobs when running through trash mobs in story missions?
Then yeah, of course you can't hold all the hate on all the mobs, especially as PLD. It's doable as WAR, but that's just a completely different discussion.
I thought you were saying how spamming Rage of Halone is somehow better than the combo for generating enmity - which MANY people would disagree with.

On King Mog, the 2 tanks typically hold 2-3 mobs (King, WAR mog, PLD Mog) while the DPS burn down the other DPS mogs. The tanks aren't expected to hold on to all 8 mobs.
Also, what helps with King Mog is making a macro that puts up number icons on each for the kill order. It's SUPER helpful, and anyone could look up how to do it.

Also, it sounds like you're talking about joining DF groups, which are notorious for not being polite, cooperative or patient. While that does represent SOME players, I sure hope it doesn't represent MOST players.

[saber_alter]

I just told you. Running over to the other enemy means you STOP focusing on what you were tanking before and give opportunities to lose the threat lead on it.

Basically your theorycrafting only works under the most ideal situations. You are completely ignoring the actual realities encountered when playing the game, which is bad DPS or not, when the party wipes the tank gets blamed and people are quick to vote abandon.

at this point what your doing is not the problem, but you are running dungeons with people better geared than you. you will lose hate in situations like this. it is going to happen, you and the other people with you will have to deal with it.

grabbing a weapon from a primal as a stepping stone to relic and starting to gear using CT/mythology tomestones would be a good starting point. the guide posted here is moreso assuming that everyone has the same gear item level.

[therpgfanatic]

Yep, I don't get why you can't just run to where the mob is beating on the DPS (especially if it were a melee that was pulling hate).
So let's say the boss "takes off" within the first 6 seconds to chase a ranged DPS ... you run after it and continue your combo, then move it back into place.

Also BLM can take 2 hits with Manawall, or reduce their enmity generation with quelling strikes, BRD can also use quelling strikes.
So let the overzealous DPS (especially if they really are i90) tank for a second or two. It probably won't kill them, and if it did, maybe they shouldn't be pulling so much hate from the get go.

I just told you. Running over to the other enemy means you STOP focusing on what you were tanking before and give opportunities to lose the threat lead on it.

Basically your theorycrafting only works under the most ideal situations. You are completely ignoring the actual realities encountered when playing the game, which is bad DPS or not, when the party wipes the tank gets blamed and people are quick to vote abandon.

I lost count of the number of times I had a group decide to abandon Ifrit Hard after 1 wipe because the DPS couldn't be bothered to take down the nails, or people who can't get the kill order correct on King Mog. The DPS blame the tanks / healers and then abandon the encounter. That's the reality of the gameplay you are not taking into consideration, so any ideas that involve asking unreasonable players to be reasonable are not practical solutions to balance the game.

Expected Player behavior is not how the game should be balanced. You balance according to actual player behavior.

[NeroMD]

Having a GC weapon is what's generally holding you back. If you spammed Ifrit Hard you would already have a somewhat decent weapon to hold you over until your Relic Quest. It's not the job itself, Yes it's harder to hold enmity as a Paladin if you're severely undergeared compared to the rest but if that is an issue to you. You should consider prioritizing yourself on fights that help you obtain better gear or spend gil on obtaining the higher Ilvl weapons/armor.

[therpgfanatic]

Having a GC weapon is what's generally holding you back. If you spammed Ifrit Hard you would already have a somewhat decent weapon to hold you over until your Relic Quest. It's not the job itself, Yes it's harder to hold enmity as a Paladin if you're severely undergeared compared to the rest but if that is an issue to you. You should consider prioritizing yourself on fights that help you obtain better gear or spend gil on obtaining the higher Ilvl weapons/armor.

Again, you are blaming the player. I have been running Ifrit Hard for 4 hours a day as a stun whore off-tank. But when DPS don't take down nails it drags the process out.

I have read all the guides. There is not a single solitary thing you can say that comes from the guides that I don't already know and have been following. Stop insulting my intelligence and listen to what I am saying.

Besides. I have serious doubts that an item lv 60 weapon is going to magically fix threat issues against item 90 folks.

PS. The Thornmarch weapon is better than the Garuda weapon and easier to run than Ifrit. Only problem I've had is lots of people don't know the kill order.

[XNihili]

Again, blaming the player. I have been running Ifrit Hard for 4 hours a day as a stun whore off-tank. But when DPS don't take down nails it drags the process out.

If the DPS can't take down the nails, it just means they aren't overgearing you ...
Anyway it's a MMORPG, like multiplayer ... If you and your party can't communicate to build a strategy to succeed, there are nothing the developers can do to help you beside nerfing the contents to Kingdom come ...