To the Dev Team. - Future Job System -

[YUGON]

classes = your weapon of choice and over all play mechanics, each class/weapon has specific play mechanics.
pley mechanics
jobs- your actual role in battle and skills/traits that lend effectiveness to that role.
class specific skills. Usually skills that tie into creating the unique play mechanics of a class/weapon and some that only make sense with that weapon
overall skills, maybe used by any class though they may be learned in relation to certain other classes
job skills, only useable by certain jobs, which help define and optomize specific roles in a party.

job is the overall role, class is the playstyle, each job works with certain classes/weapons, some more specialized than others.

this system still allows for a custom class creation, while defining your role in a battle.

Hello Physic!!

I don't understand your point.

You want SE to keep with the classes and give us the chance to "job that class", being a powerful version of the class?? (With unique skills, abilities, etc..)

Or unlock the job and level it, being able to switch between your class (Gladiator) and your job (Paladin)??

Please, can you calrify me your point, to edit it in the post??

thanks.

[Physic]

Hello Physic!!

I don't understand your point.

You want SE to keep with the classes and give us the chance to "job that class", being a powerful version of the class?? (With unique skills, abilities, etc..)

Or unlock the job and level it, being able to switch between your class (Gladiator) and your job (Paladin)??

Please, can you calrify me your point, to edit it in the post??

thanks.

I dont believe in the releveling of jobs, or trying to take the skill sets of classes and make them jobs, first of all none of the classes, except maybe glad seems like it lines up with a classic job.

i believe they should use a title system, or an an extra layer for jobs, similar to what they apparently have planned, but they shouldnt make jobs a specialization of a specific class. a Job should be an overall role choice in a party, your class should be your technique in executing said role.

for example, as it stands, a pugilist is a fast attacking, combo using, reactive playstyle. but that doesnt define a role. lets say paladin was a tank role, designed around being able to self heal, increase defensive abilities, and gain enimity/protect party members with a White magic feel.
you could apply that to
pugilist playstyle, single target reactive evasion, self healing (pugilist gets more from heals)
gladiator playstyle single target slow, but most pure damage reduction versus a single target
marauder playstyle. multi target aoe actions and enimity building skills

I feel leveling a job which is basically identical to a class, minus a few skills, is bad game design. People who want this are driven by the lack of jobs to level now, and not an overall good vision for the game as a whole, for new players, and the future.

I feel that by making jobs into a system on top of classes, it allows for unique roles, without pigeonholding classes to a specific role for all time.

Scrapping the class/armory system for the purpose of creating more classic classes, feels like a bad idea to me. If you really were going to scrap the system, then i would remake it in a totally different way. the one road lifestyle for classes, doesnt sound good for this game, the whole game should be designed for that type of world, this game feels like it should be more free. the armory system actually makes sense on many levels.

They should also add saving of class skill loadouts, and add some that are given by npcs, for people who dont know how to make good builds.

Tutorials for classes, so as to train people in how to best use class mechanics. The game is in desperate need of a training room.

[Kiara]

Hi All,

I agree with ClashBlades, physic and Sephr:

Given what Matsui-san said about the Job System already (that it is a *playing style* using the Base Class as the basis (so the majority of the weaponskills and abilities come from the Base Class)):

I'd like the new Job System to have a challenging, multi-step set of Quests to Unlock the Job.

I'd like there to be challenging, engaging, multi-step sets of Quests to Unlock each of the Limited, New Weaponskills / Abilities for each New Job.

I hope they are challenging enough that it may take multiple tries and thoughtful strategy to unlock everything about that Job (the Job itself, and each of the limited, new Abilities).

[Cairdeas]

I do not like Weapons being locked to Jobs, I don't mind them being locked to classes. But at this point I'd rather they scrap the entire system. Leave the armoury system for the crafters and the job system for the combat Job.

Make Classes Crafters and Jobs Fighters.

[Sephr]

Relevelling jobs makes little sense, because they are simply extensions of the current classes in various directions. A paladin will use many of the same skills as a Gladiator, with a few more gained via quests.

The reason they won't seperate classes from jobs (not only because of the above reason, that they're pretty much the same thing) is because they want everyone to be able to solo in the way they want to. This means that a conjurer will be able to solo relatively easily up to the max rank at the time, and then also switch to White mage when the situation calls for it but not have to suffer the shitty levelling process as a WHM who has little no offensive capability.

I don't get why people want to level it all over again. The difference between a Gladiator and a paladin won't be enough to warrant the need to relevel it in order to be 'skilled' at it. MMOs aren't that hard.

Classes meet the needs of people wanting to be casual and generally mould a class how they want to. Jobs meet the needs of people wanting classic job roles, and to feel like they're fulfilling a classic need.

I don't know why people are so hung up on it, for a FFXI reference: Imagine if a Scholar had to level up to max on the basic class, then the Dark Arts form and Light arts form. It's the same sort of situation, just extensions of a basic form.

[Kiara]

Relevelling jobs makes little sense, because they are simply extensions of the current classes in various directions. A paladin will use many of the same skills as a Gladiator, with a few more gained via quests.

The reason they won't seperate classes from jobs (not only because of the above reason, that they're pretty much the same thing) is because they want everyone to be able to solo in the way they want to. This means that a conjurer will be able to solo relatively easily up to the max rank at the time, and then also switch to White mage when the situation calls for it but not have to suffer the shitty levelling process as a WHM who has little no offensive capability.

I don't get why people want to level it all over again. The difference between a Gladiator and a paladin won't be enough to warrant the need to relevel it in order to be 'skilled' at it. MMOs aren't that hard.

Classes meet the needs of people wanting to be casual and generally mould a class how they want to. Jobs meet the needs of people wanting classic job roles, and to feel like they're fulfilling a classic need.

I don't know why people are so hung up on it, for a FFXI reference: Imagine if a Scholar had to level up to max on the basic class, then the Dark Arts form and Light arts form. It's the same sort of situation, just extensions of a basic form.

Hi YUGON,

I applaud you for trying to aggregate everyone's thoughts on the Job System into 1 Thread. I'm not sure how accurate it'll be, but at least you're trying.

I think one sentiment needs to be clarified in the request where people are asking for "Jobs to start at Level 1," it's what Sephr and physic have brought up in a few threads (and what I agree on):

* Jobs should start at Level 1 only if it was an entirely, completely NEW "Job" with ~40 - 50 NEW Skills and Weaponskills.

Matsui-san and Yoshida-san have stated already that the "Jobs" we're getting are roles, a play style, *not* an entirely "New Job (with its own 40 - 50 New Skills).

Rather than being advanced versions of classes, we would like players to think of jobs as specialized playing styles optimized for partying. (Akihiko Matsui)

Given that, we may realistically see only a handful of Special Skills associated with it. Let's say for example, Paladin. Given Matsui-san and Yoshida-san's comments about the limited number of skills, let's say they plan to add 4 New Skills to the Paladin:

* Holy
* Final Phalanx
* Provoke III
* Invincibility (2 Hour)

The *rest* of the Paladin's Skill Set is from Gladiator. It makes no sense to level up Paladin from Rank 1 all the way up to Rank 50 (FIFTY) for 4 new skills.

I think the big picture request from those that want a Rank 1 Job is that it comes with a Full Set (40 - 50 New Skills / Abilities).

And the big picture request from people who are fine with the Rank 50 Gladiator = Rank 50 Paladin, who want challenging Job Quests, and Job Skill Unlock Quests is from the condition that Matsui-san said we're NOT removing Classes, so Jobs are a *Play Style, with a very limited # of additional Skills.*

If they really made White Mage have 50 New Skills and be completely different from Conjurer, of course I can understand the sentiment of leveling White Mage from Rank 1. But it's not the case. That's an important clarification that needs to be made if you're trying to represent everyone's sentiments accurately.

Thanks.

[Blitz0309]

Well, any job system i would want would require the currently armory system scrapped. And since they have said they aren't going to do that. Well... i guess its pointless to even discuss it.

[YUGON]

Well, any job system i would want would require the currently armory system scrapped. And since they have said they aren't going to do that. Well... i guess its pointless to even discuss it.

It may be pointless, but is better try it, than just sit and see what they do.

Thanks for your opinion =)

[Reinheart]

just what if for Jobs you get whatever weapon you can use for the class +1 extra weapon, or more specific weapon of that weapon category. Dunno how they are planning the job system until they announce something (HOPEFULLY SOON!!!) but if class stays the same but job can be upgraded split off into more jobs in the future it will end up with more weapon variety the Job can equip.

Like how the hell you going to do Red Mage or Blue Mage when DOM can't equip any sword, I don't want to see RDM that can't equip swords or Black Mage that can't use a dagger (although I always stuck with staff/rod in most cases in regular FF series)

Really want more info on the job system >< could be a game changer depending on how the system is made, and I really want to have some kind of point/leveling system in the job... I don't want to suddenly become a Job that has all the abilities and I didn't actually learn it on the way. Fun part for me on leveling up jobs in say FF5 was learning new spells as you gain levels, reason it kept me leveling that job (+ getting MASTER in all jobs in FF5)

[WiiSam]

Weapons being locked to jobs is not a bad thing, what they should do is add a more variety of weapons to lock to said class.

For example, hopefully at R50 a Gladiator can pick to be Paladin or Warrior: Paladin would equip swords, maces, daggers etc and a shield, Warrior will equip two weapons (Dual Wield).

Archer for example will be able to pick between Musketeer for Guns or some other long range weapons depending on the path they choose. That would solve the issue of classes being locked to weapons.

As for how the "Jobs" such as Paladin are acquired, I think there should be specific skills and abilities you should equip before it is unlocked and you will start at 50 but the max lvl for these "Advanced Jobs" can be increased to say 75.

For example, Gladiator gets ro R50, to unlock Paladin he will need to equip Cure 2 and maybe some other skills so to become a Paladin you must have GLA at 50 and CONJURER at 30. Once the required skills are equipped you become a paladin and you can then rank up to 75 to learn new Paladin ONLY skills.

Another example, to become a Warrior, you will need GLA at 50 and various attack skills from the dual wielding PUG. So once you have R30 PUG and R50 GLA you can unlock the dual wielding WARRIOR at R50 and rank that WARRIOR up to 75 to learn new WARRIOR ONLY skills!