So no more story for me

[KraggyKor]

See, I'm an average sort of player, I'm not especially skilled and 'normal' fights can be a challenge for me. In spite of that I have been able to complete the Main Story as far as it went on release, using AF gear, just like in FFXI.

I was able to complete ALL FFXI expansions (except the last which I haven't bothered with) with only 'normal' or HQ-crafted gear.

Now however it seems I am unable to carry on playing the Main Story as Primal HMs are now part of it, as the just-published translation of the last Producer Live clearly states. There'll be no 'story' Leviathin, only HM and EX. In FFXI terms this would be Chapter 6 (ending in the fight with Shadow Lord) requiring gear from Dynmis.

So FFXIV is now a hard-core gear grind with some story elements and not the story-based MMO with phat lewt available for those that want it.

Seems in FFXIV I'll only ever be able to complete the initial release, not even the 'free content updates' that come before the first expansion.

[Chevrefoil]

Did you notice what you called yourself?

Average. Because -more- players are like you than those who find extreme modes (or even hard modes) "easy".

I firmly believe that FFXIV wants to be a game that's accessible to the vast majority of its player base -- whether it's through "buffs" to make content easier for more average players or overgearing content. I reserve judgment to see what happens with Leviathan; it could very well be that hard-mode for a primal that is intended to be released to lvl 50 players is more like the "story" modes we are accustomed to for other bosses, except, perhaps requiring a larger group. I think anything else (if it ties into a main storyline) would be a mistake since most players are -average-.

[Neablis]

The gear grind on this game isn't that bad que up for a few dungeons a week and boom you get a new piece generally.

Also they have been pretty adamant that leviathan is part of the story, just more than likely he will start in "hard mode". Which he should be slightly harder than moggle king or just as "hard" as titan just not with as many 1 shot capabilities lol.

[Nekodar]

Now however it seems I am unable to carry on playing the Main Story as Primal HMs are now part of it, as the just-published translation of the last Producer Live clearly states. There'll be no 'story' Leviathin, only HM and EX. In FFXI terms this would be Chapter 6 (ending in the fight with Shadow Lord) requiring gear from Dynmis.

So FFXIV is now a hard-core gear grind with some story elements and not the story-based MMO with phat lewt available for those that want it.

If you read again you'll see they stated Leviathan HM has been tuned to take into account players that found Thornmarch too hard before it was toned down.
Thornmarch was toned down as well because a lot of players got stuck there and couldn't proceed with story.
I believe Thornmarch is also referred to as a "hardmode" because it's intended for 8 man parties.
For people that want more challenge, they then add the "extreme" versions.


Essentially, all new Primal fights will be "hardmode" because they're 8 man ones, and they will also get "extreme" versions at the same time, but because the new "hardmode" Primals belong to story, they will be tuned so that any proper 8 man party can take it on.

[Delsus]

Honestly for gear just queue for dungeons in DF, if you want verity you don't have to do what most of us do and spam WP/AK go for the other dungeons as well. The reason people say it's such a grind is because people talk about spamming WP/AK because they are about the most efficient way, but it really feels like a grind like that.

Honestly if you switch it up it won't feel like a "hard-core gear grind" you will progress slower but you will get there.

[Tupsi]

If you read again you'll see they stated Leviathan HM has been tuned to take into account players that found Thornmarch too hard before it was toned down.

I skipped out on this letter...but...

Leviathan HM has been tuned to take into account players that found Thornmarch too hard before it was toned down.

There's just no hope left.

[Nekodar]

There's just no hope left.

There's Leviathan Extreme as well...

Thing is, when it's required for main story, they simply can't set the level too high or people will get stuck there.

It may be that you need to have at least Garuda HM level weapon and other other gear to take on Leviathan HM, which is not unreasonable, and that the fight itself will be equal in difficulty at that gear level as Ifrit HM was at around i50-i55.
In other words, 2-3 tries to learn the fight and once you've learned it, fairly easy win.

I expect Leviathan Extreme to be a different matter with ilevel requirement to enter being higher than Ifrit Extreme.

[Tupsi]

To be fair though, Titan Extreme for example is easier than Titan Hard unless you happen to fall into the bracket of players that go through level3 and the like which is having issues and thus causing weird latency problems at times. So while Extreme tend to be "more mechanics in yo face!" it just means that overall they're developing toward making sure no one can get "stuck" even though MMOs usually had gated content and no one complained about. All this really does though is justify them artificially extending content by making things so easy that they need to add lockouts of some kind to keep people from depleting new patch content quickly.

Ilvl requirement though is a double edged thing - On one hand, SE sets the level and by time you hit 50 and even do a slight bit of end-game you can enter every extreme primal easily, however the players set things to like ilvl 80-90 even though it's not NECESSARILY needed. Hell I think Garuda Extreme also is easier than Garuda HM, you just have more to look out for, but for the most part you're generally 'stationary'. IE though is actually the more different. So maybe Leviathan X will be tougher, but I think this fear of challenging content in main progression will end up biting them sooner or later, it always does to developers these days.

[Aegis]

The reason the base Leviathan fight will be 'Hard Mode' just like Moogle is, is because all the non-hardmode primals are for players below level 50.

It doesn't mean it will be as hard as Titan HM, for example, just that it will need 8 people at level 50. I wouldn't worry too much.

If it's any consolation, I farm Garuda Ex, and Coils turns 1-4, and I still had trouble with Moogle before they tuned it down.

[Eagleheart]

See, I'm an average sort of player, I'm not especially skilled and 'normal' fights can be a challenge for me. In spite of that I have been able to complete the Main Story as far as it went on release, using AF gear, just like in FFXI.

I was able to complete ALL FFXI expansions (except the last which I haven't bothered with) with only 'normal' or HQ-crafted gear.

Now however it seems I am unable to carry on playing the Main Story as Primal HMs are now part of it, as the just-published translation of the last Producer Live clearly states. There'll be no 'story' Leviathin, only HM and EX. In FFXI terms this would be Chapter 6 (ending in the fight with Shadow Lord) requiring gear from Dynmis.

So FFXIV is now a hard-core gear grind with some story elements and not the story-based MMO with phat lewt available for those that want it.

Seems in FFXIV I'll only ever be able to complete the initial release, not even the 'free content updates' that come before the first expansion.

Terrible analogy, and you have not even tried yet.

Of course you're gonna lose. You gave up before the patch even landed.

You could defeat all the Primal EX with "HQ Crafted gear" as exists in-game right now. The HM will be no issue, but it might require you to do something more than spam auto-attack and wait for 100 TP.

Truly, the end is nigh.