Why mark targets?

[YuriRamona]

While I agree that the op's argument has almost nothing to do with his title, very few dots require their full duration in order to be efficient. Just throwing that out there.

Thanks for contributing. I would avoid arguing with that one, as it seems they're not really willing to debate the numbers (because apparently this means we "must see the largest possible numbers from each engagement to feel satisfaction"?).

It seems like almost blatantly obvious common sense that DoTs are the best tool in the damage toolbox, behind only AoE. I can see now that it's really not that apparent to most people.

[Langureion]

Wel, ppl will learn when their characters hit the ground, it's that simple.

[CyanDvai]

Just to toss out another comment about marking.
As a tank I don't always mark target. If I don't mark a target then I don't care which ones you focus on, I'll hold hate on all of them and if I loose hate on one then that is my fault.
If I specifically want a certain mob to go down first then I'll toss a 1 on it before I pull.

Only other time I mark targets is if a party member specifically requests me to do so. I had a guy ask me to mark in AV when we reached the first boss, so after the boss was dead I marked each pull. I would mark 1 first, pull and then mark 2 and 3.

Marking is not hard, but it's tedious especially when you've ran the same dungeon a dozen times and for the most party people should know the kill order. It's only really beneficial when there's a new person in the dungeon or someone who doesn't know all the pulls yet.

[glen7187]

It seems like almost blatantly obvious common sense that DoTs are the best tool in the damage toolbox, behind only AoE. I can see now that it's really not that apparent to most people.

While I don't entirely disagree with that, I think it is kind of situational. As a Bard, I will DoT everything in the group but mostly because I want the Bloodletter procs. However, as a BLM, just because of cast time mostly, I feel like trying to keep my Thunder 3 up on all targets is slowing me down when I can be going through my ST rotation or AoE rotation. So in the case of my BLM, I wouldn't DoT everything.

EDIT: I know you said behind AoE, but I mean in a situation where it may be 2 or 3 mobs.

[Mailstrum]

Also, your second graphic is actually showing the health bars of the enemies remaining on the field - not the threat. In the pic:

actuallly his second picture does show threat Red yellow Green dots. If the Dots are green means you do not have agro.. if the dots are yellow that means you are getting close to pulling agro....and if they are red you have agro..... and they gradually change. So yellow doesnt go from bright yellow to red. It goes Yellow to yellow orange even darker yellow orange then red.

and they change shape as well for color blind people.

[Alkimi]

Also, the quicker a mob dies, the less damage it does, the easier the healers job is, dont be an inconsiderate tank. You have just as equal, if not more important role in managing your health.

Not to mention that the less healing spam that needs to be done, the more the healer can potentially throw in some dps, which throws the whole "DoTs yield higher damage" argument out the window.

[Viridiana]

Not to mention that the less healing spam that needs to be done, the more the healer can potentially throw in some dps, which throws the whole "DoTs yield higher damage" argument out the window.

It's like neither of you read where the OP repeatedly said "Don't do this if incoming damage is actually an issue!"

[TouchandFeel]

I believe that marking is a good idea and that most tanks in most situations should do it.
How dps react to marking is up to them, but it helps provide information and direction for what the tank intends.
It is also incredibly easy to do. In most instances when I am running a dungeon, I will just select my initial target and mark them with 1 as I am closing on them or right before the pull. Then after I have flashed and gone through a full combo and rotate to the next target to build agro I then mark them with 2 and so on.
This takes almost no time and can be very beneficial.

[Grelvin]

As a low lvl tank, marking is working out for me.

Ironically what isn't, is melee assisting me. They continue to assist me as I switch through mobs to keep hate up, which ultimately defeats the purpose of marking.

I'll still mark though, it's almost 90pct for the bard/blm though. Those are the only 2 I really give a rip about knowing what they are attacking. Once a mob leaves the pile, it makes things more difficult for me.

Fortunately, I've had pretty good success with people following the marks.

I understand the low lvl perspective isn't valued, but all the same, I see value in marking, and will continue to do it as long as I have room for the buttons to do so.

[Kyros]

If people actually viewed tanks as leaders, then obviously, I wouldn't have posted this, would I? I'm trying to get feedback on how to encourage DPS to maximize their damage, whether it's through AoE or with DoTs. I've tried reasoning, using math, or just being a dictator. Thus far, no approach has proven reliable.

It is because your math relies on a lot of wrong assumptions:

1) That Physical DPS's have infinite TP. Most AoE's and DoT's have higher-than-average TP consumptions. AoE/dotting everything is simply not sustainable.

2) That Physical DPS have no upkeep buffs. Both MNK and DRG rely heavily on keeping certain stacks up.

3) Less Finishing Abilities. Mercy Stroke and Misery's end will be proc'd less if the mobs die at around the same time.

4) Tanks that don't mark are usually terrible. You are asking your party to both go the extra mile and take a leap of faith for an insignificant increase in DPS; whereas you can't be bothered to do something as simple as marking? I wouldn't trust you to keep hate on one target, much less 3.

5) It complicates Healing DPS. "Maximizing DPS" involves the healer contributing. The longer 3 mobs are up the less time a healer has to contribute. The longer mobs are up has an inverse relationship to how often I can Cleric stance-dps as a healer. The faster the first mob goes down the more DPS I can contribute.


As a tank one of the first things you have to learn is to know which DPS is best doing what. Your SMN and BLM should be DoT/AoEing everything respectively, whereas your MNK and DRG should be focusing single targets down (Wish small exceptions). Asking the MNK/DRG to AoE everything is like asking your SMN/BLM to focus a single target: it's retarded. It makes me glad that most of your parties had the common sense to stick to what they do best.

Trying to maximize DPS is a noble goal, but what you are doing is not the right way. I'd sooner free space for my healer to help (And tell him he should be) than run my melee DPS's dry.