Why mark targets?

[ERob3000]

I mark for PUG groups and only when I want a target burned down quickly (ex: Tons in WP).

[bokchoykn]

Marking targets doesn't mean "only damage this target". You can mark a target while still having the DPS dot the unmarked or the (2) and (3) targets or AoE the pack down.

The purpose of marking targets in 4-man dungeons is so that your two DPS don't completely split their non-DoT damage. It simply communicates to the team which mob you intend on building the most aggro on, so they can DPS accordingly. It doesn't say they can't use DoTs or AoE on the other targets.

[YuriRamona]

Marking targets doesn't mean "only damage this target". You can mark a target while still having the DPS dot the unmarked or the (2) and (3) targets or AoE the pack down.

The purpose of marking targets in 4-man dungeons is so that your two DPS don't completely split their non-DoT damage. It simply communicates to the team which mob you intend on building the most aggro on, so they can DPS accordingly. It doesn't say they can't use DoTs or AoE on the other targets.

Yes, this is true. Of course, the DPS are free to DoT even when marks are up. I should have clarified that, for me, marking is almost always equated with "focus down one at a time".

E.g. bees in Sunken Temple, bastards get to do a Final Sting if DPS is split and it becomes stun resistant due to diminishing returns.
Or just killing the little Twintania dragons so they don't spew liquid hell all over the place as long.

Yes, these are good examples where marking is very useful. I would also include Handmaidens (as mentioned by another person here), as well as the big toads in Dzemael/AV.

I'm just trying to speak generally about avoiding marking in most situations as a means to discourage DPS from focusing down one target at a time on ordinary trash enemies.

Even in the examples we have, though, of where focusing down one target at a time is important, it's still arguably important to spread DoTs to the second and third target in that focus list. While the first one will die much more quickly if the DPS don't spread their DoTs to the second and third targets, the total time taken is greatly increased if DoTs are not employed to maximum effect.

[bokchoykn]

Yes, this is true. Of course, DPS are free to DoT even when marks are up. I should have clarified that, for me, marking is almost always equated with "focus down one at a time".

No, it means "if you're going to go balls out on one of the mobs, do it to THIS one."

I just mark my targets accordingly and leave it up to my DPS whether they think they should DoT other targets or AoE them down. At the end of the day, not using DoTs on #2 and #3 would maybe add 1-2 seconds to each pull. I'd rather spend an extra minute in a dungeon than argue with my DPS over such trivial matters.

[inkuzen]

Marking targets doesn't mean "only damage this target". You can mark a target while still having the DPS dot the unmarked or the (2) and (3) targets or AoE the pack down.

The purpose of marking targets in 4-man dungeons is so that your two DPS don't completely split their non-DoT damage. It simply communicates to the team which mob you intend on building the most aggro on, so they can DPS accordingly. It doesn't say they can't use DoTs or AoE on the other targets.

I fully agree with this sentiment. Marking helps ensure that whatever single focus damage they are going to do goes to the target I'm building the most aggro on, they can still AoE or DoT the mob 2 and 3, but if they're using a focus attack at a mob it should be at the one I'm using my non AOE hate generating abilities on.

[Fiosha_Maureiba]

Marking gives a clearer order of who should be getting attacked after the first target dies. I'll often use the tank's target as my target, but if they're switching targets to hold hate on each and now the DPS is split, it usually means both enemies live longer and this in turn requires more healing or a chance that an enemy will do another major ability before it dies.

E.g. bees in Sunken Temple, bastards get to do a Final Sting if DPS is split and it becomes stun resistant due to diminishing returns.
Or just killing the little Twintania dragons so they don't spew liquid hell all over the place as long.
In a lot of content, the marking is "silent", e.g. kill order for Garuda sisters, Turn 4 waves, but some form of coordination for single target tends to help the outcome more than being free for all and each party needing to dynamically adapt to another player.

[Skies]

Let's begin some explanations, then, Yuri.
First, DPS like to coordinate, we like to focus-fire on the same target while we are dealing ST damage, so having something to guide is through is great. Often one wants the tank to chose the threats according to what he considers worst, personally as a tank I always mark mage enemies first since they are a particular pain for me, but a friend of mine normally points the biggest-damage enemy regardless.

Second, you are in fact fundamentally wrong about the DPS of dots and AoEs. For melee, at least. For both monk and dragoon one of our DoTs is in the tail end of a combo, DoTs also take far too long to tick down completely, more than the encounter should last after the application of the first comboless one so there would be a long stretch of time where we should use our AoE attacks.
Also, AoE attacks consume a LOT of TP for melee, we run dry extremely fast using to the it's impossible to do two pulls back to back, and for both monk and dragoon our most TP-efficient and powerful AoE is ALSO part of a combo, so we need a single-target attack before moving into AoE, thus we'd like to focus-fire that too.

The only time I'm 100% okay with a tank not marking is when I am running with my FC, as we are long-time friends and know eachother enough that there is no need for marks for the DDs to synergize their attacks as we know which are our target priorities.

[YuriRamona]

Second, you are in fact fundamentally wrong about the DPS of dots and AoEs. For melee, at least. For both monk and dragoon one of our DoTs is in the tail end of a combo, DoTs also take far too long to tick down completely, more than the encounter should last after the application of the first comboless one so there would be a long stretch of time where we should use our AoE attacks.
Also, AoE attacks consume a LOT of TP for melee, we run dry extremely fast using to the it's impossible to do two pulls back to back, and for both monk and dragoon our most TP-efficient and powerful AoE is ALSO part of a combo, so we need a single-target attack before moving into AoE, thus we'd like to focus-fire that too.

Obviously, the enemy will die before the DoT ticks to full if you're focusing down one at a time. If you're applying DoTs evenly across enemies and also spreading your single-target weaponskills, then almost all enemies will take longer than 18-30 seconds to fall.

I see this contradiction all the time. A common excuse is "well, the enemy dies in less than 18 seconds anyway, so DoT is not worth it." Yes, but this is only the case if you only use single-target attacks on one enemy at a time.

And yes, AoE abilities are not very TP-efficient. However, single-target combos are only second on the list in terms of TP-efficiency. DoTs are the most TP-efficient, bar none.

[WellFooled]

If you're applying DoTs evenly across enemies and also spreading your single-target weaponskills, then almost all enemies will take longer than 18-30 seconds to fall.
[/B]

In this case you may be maximizing damage, but at the expense of other things. For example, when you kill a monster it can no longer deal damage to you, which means the healer and tank's jobs gets easier. However if you deal equal amounts of damage to all monsters you'll have to put up with the max amount of damage sustained for the entire duration of the pull.

There are also many situations where an enemy group isn't sitting in a tiny little compact space. You've got ranged monster hitting you from afar. To spread dots and single target weaponskills out evenly would require the melee dps to run from target to target after every GCD, which would ruin your dps.

There are also many situations where a single monster poses way more of a threat (or maybe just an annoyance) than other monsters (like the succubus in AK, who can hit you with powerful AoE magic) and should be killed so that threat is eliminated. This is also the case in dozens of boss fights. If you don't kill the adds, they'll eventually overwhelm you.

[Viridiana]

snip

1) That's cool, but the OP already said he only meant for this to apply when incoming damage is not a concern.

2) Doesn't apply to BRD, so you agree BRD should always multi-dot? And that melee should multi-dot if the mobs are close together?

3) Those monsters are often still part of a pack. Kill them, then spread dots over the rest of the pack. BTW, the Succubi in AK should never even touch you. . .