Why mark targets?

[Coth_X]

If DPS don't know what to attack first by the time they're 50 something is seriously wrong. Watch the tank, attack their primary target first. Not difficult. For the majority of the dungeons there's an established kill order which tanks will follow. Marking is a crutch for clueless DPS in my experience. I only do it when I notice that DPS are being chumps and attacking targets out of order. Or i'll do stuff like mark the gob that stops the birds spawning in Brayflox. English players struggle with hitting correct targets a lot more than JP players, especially in Duty Roulette.

Also, dotting multiple trash mobs is pointless.

I disagree, I'll mark my targets because whether I'm having to OP x bajillion(what a fun game ; -; ) or actually getting to use other attacks, I want everyone to know what order I'm going in, especially for melee dps since their dps specifically depends on mobs facing away from them. That's where i'm dumping auto attacks, stuns, and maybe sunders, if all im doing is oping, or that's where most of my enmity dump is going if i'm getting to play the game.

Furthermore, I find while trying to level monk, figuring out the tank's primary target is annoying at best, since if the mobs are clumped up I can't depend on the targeting line, and otherwise, I have to target the tank and then target his enemy.

Why are people against communication and coordination? In an MMO?

[blowfin]

Why are people against communication and coordination? In an MMO?

I'm not against communication and coordination, I just have a problem with providing crutches for people. Basically, if you keep giving them that, they won't learn for themselves. It might sound slightly harsh but it's actually the best outcome for everyone.

Again, not saying I don't mark in certain situations, I just don't do it religiously.

Sometimes you don't even need to mark to sort things out. A simple "Could you guys please kill the Wamoura's first" does the trick too.

[Alice_89th]

Marking may not help increasing outgoing damage, but it definitly helps decrease the incoming damage.

By quickly eliminating enemies with harmful abilities or healing skills, and/or showing which target to focus on. It shows which mob to return to when all DoTs/ other tricks are done. It prevents you DPS from attacking two different mobs, and burn down one instead. Which means less incoming damage, which means less strain on the healer, which means the healer might even have free time to DPS. It helps prevent the DPS accidently pull agro. It teaches people who are new to a dungeon certain mechanics. It teaches people who are not new to a dungeon but who didn't encounter any problems in earlier runs certain mechanics.

TL;DR: it makes a run go smoother.

I'm not against communication and coordination, I just have a problem with providing crutches for people. Basically, if you keep giving them that, they won't learn for themselves. It might sound slightly harsh but it's actually the best outcome for everyone.

Again, not saying I don't mark in certain situations, I just don't do it religiously.

But how are people supposed to learn if someone doesn't show them?
Yes you learn from mistakes, but it is a lot faster if you simply explain (by marking or otherwise) once. Marking or explaining doesn't stop them from learning to do things on their own, it helps them learn faster. It is not a crutch to help people walk, it is a roadsign to show them which direction to walk in.

Yes, this is true. Of course, the DPS are free to DoT even when marks are up. I should have clarified that, for me, marking is almost always equated with "focus down one at a time".

Except that marks don't tell you to tunel vision an enemy, but that that one takes priority. Even for DoT classes that can be helpfull. For example: I am a SMN, I will DoT the tarket marked with 1, and then use Bane to spread to the rest. This way the priority target will have a few more ticks. It also tells me which target to return to when I have every single DoT up and a few spare moments to do something else, and which target I should put Garuda on.

[Coth_X]

I just don't see how marking targets is a crutch.

[Snorgrind]

im tanking from launch and after my past experiences i gave up marking in df cuz good dps know what to do and dont need it and bad dps dont read or follow it at all.

[GunksFoy]

Someone may have stated this in the last few pages of the thread, I didn't check, but you realize that Full Thrust on drg does 330 potency instantly, and you can have cycled through this rotation twice by the time your dots expire, meaning that your math is completely flawed due to the fact that the single target rotation hits twice in the time dots can go through once. Therefore, you need to double that potency for your math to be correct, which, as you'll see, Is higher than dots.

[Shinkyo]

snip

+1 on that one.
While Marking should only be a nice to have at endgame, it's still a good tanking practice. though it may not always add value, it's never hurt to do it.

As for the dots, it's not true always that dots yield superior DPS because of combo bonuses. it's really class specific.
Also, we're talking about trash pulls so applying dot on every target would only shortening the pull by a few seconds while increasing the incoming damage and targeting complexity.

[ariaandkia]

+1 on that one.
While Marking should only be a nice to have at endgame, it's still a good tanking practice. though it may not always add value, it's never hurt to do it.

As for the dots, it's not true always that dots yield superior DPS because of combo bonuses. it's really class specific.
Also, we're talking about trash pulls so applying dot on every target would only shortening the pull by a few seconds while increasing the incoming damage and targeting complexity.

This

I have a few different rotations for BLM depending on the party. I had one older rotation that I don't use anymore since I shouldn't be tanking bosses. (Since I don't use it anymore, I don't have it memorized-a pity since I finally met some tanks that can hold aggro).

Regardless, to DoT or not to DoT? To do AoEs or not to AoE? It really depends on the situation.

For example, Stone Vigil Aevis mobs. Most tanks prefer that you don't AoE and that you drop one down. Why? They can't be slept, do a relatively high amount of damage, and do plenty of AoEs. So the goal is to drop one quickly, then get to work on the next. This is to reduce the chance that the healer will run out of MP and the Tank dying or reduce the chance that the healer can't keep up with the heals and the Tank dying or that the Tank will just straight die from the damage.

In addition, certain classes do MORE damage (specifically speaking of either time or TP/MP, not both) by focusing on one enemy instead of multiple. Especially for tanks that try to spread enmity (which means they might target multiple enemies), it can be difficult to make sure you are attacking the tank's intended target. I've had a few times where I notice that the DPS are attacking different targets from the tank completely (as in no enmity from certain DPS on certain targets).

[Algin]

I'll tell you, why I mark trash, from the view of new FFXIV and new PLD tank. I do it, because it makes the job easier for me. I'm learning in those low level early dungeons how to keep aggro, how to maintain proper rotation, how to make sure that all mobs are on me. It is helpful when I mark the targets, so the DPS can focus on one mob and then switch to another, because it gives me more time to react, if something goes bad, I mess up and loose the enmity. Sometimes it's just enough to mark the one I'm pulling, sometimes not... Also, if I'm in new dungeon for the first time, and I run with experienced players, I ask them to mark the correct order for me, as they know, which mob should be taked down first, as it does most trouble.

And on the other hand, as a new player, I've to say, that lots of people are really helpful. As soon as I state on the start of dunegon, that I'm new, they offer helpful advice, lots of tips and are doing stuff more slowly, to not scare me away.

[AlrikRouge]

Did LL roulette as a tank. Had i90+ MNK and i90+ BRD in the group. Yes, level synced.

Figured that hey, super beefed party, shouldn't need to mark since they should be street smart and attack the same mob when a small pull was done.

Nope. Only when I started marking. And even then, only when I finally just let the BRD have his/her #2 marked mob and almost died did they finally coordinate and take one down at a time. Sometimes people just want to learn the hard way.