Geomancer (CNJ Job) concept

[jomoru]

If cures were potentially altered into something based on their Defense setup it might be workable but it seems like ti would be difficult And as was said it would have substandard DPS for soloing compared to even Paladin. Honestly I'd imagine Thaum or Pug branching into tanking first as they already have afew Defensive cooldowns to work with.;

[Tzain]

I'm sorry...but this is a non-start design (and I am not one to say that often).

First problem is that you are attempting to change the base line effects of class skills. Adding Additional effects while under the effect of something else (See Warrior Defiance and Combos) is fine, but changing the baseline like Cleric Stance is a no-Go, otherwise it would be done elsewhere already.

Second problem is the change of the traits. Not to say this "Couldnt" be done, but it's not currently done, so the assumption should be that it is not done. Otherwise, Arcanist would be doing it right now when it switches to Scholar.

Third problem. A Geomancer is a Conjurer, a Conjurer is a healer. The big problem here is that you now have a DPS role with a massive amount of healing OR a large number of useless skills (Cure 1,2,3, Medica 1, 2) and traits. Neither are going to be particularly healthy.

Since the cleric stance change is a no-go, it's in the CNJ best interest to use Cleric stance for the dmg boost. This means MIND gear is the preferred set up. Clearly, this is not a sustainable or balanced function as a group with 2 GEOs is 1 button away from having 2 Healers or 2 DPS depending on whats needed. Even if the GEOs were using INT gear, they could actually invert Cleric Stance in order to pump their mind stat at a 20% penalty which grants a gamebreaking amount of healing considering their innate access to Medica II and how it stacks.

1 PLD, 1 WHM, 6 GEOs. The combination would trivialize damn near anything with just a coordinated Medica II blast every 30 seconds.


I would HEAVILY suggest not looking at CNJ for a Cross Role job. They are just way too focus built as a healer to effectively leave it behind without being broken. As it stands, I cannot find a way to make this viable.


HOWEVER

There is room within the healer role for a Geomancer type design. I built one a few months back as an offensive Proactive healer that incentivizes staying in Cleric Stance. I can try to drag it up, clean it up, and repost it up if anyone wants. I don't want to hijack the thread (as Kitru can attest, I have a bad habit of doing that while trying to be helpful.)

[RickmanUK]

Hmm.. I Don't Know i Can Envision Conjurer's having a "Secret order" of Geomancer's who are "Nature's Avenger's"... Nature is Kind and nurturing, unyielding and strong. You Piss it off and it will END YOU.

I'd See the first ability they get as a "Stance" that give's them a Stacking Mechanic like Defiance does, that they can trade-in for extra Damage abilities (And Possibly borrow from Monk's Abit, Make it do increased damage on spells as it Stacks) This "Elemental Fury" would also as someone else Stated Convert some Spells into Damaging Versions instead. (Esuna into an Inflict/Bio Spell, Medica into an AoE Poision/Aero, Cure 2 and 3 into Attacks.)

Also rather then Ground Based Target Spells... Have them as Target Based DoT-AoE's. Tornado would Have a Bind Effect on it and do AoE too All in range of it's Primary Target, Quake would Slow/Paralyse all target's in it's Range Etc. Point is The Idea is Workable... Just not in the way Stated by the OP.

[Viviza]

It wouldn't be hard to make a geomancer job.

Summoners and scholars already have different versions of the same spell (summons). Just because a WHM uses all the CNJ spells as-is doesn't mean a GEO can't take a few and switch them to offensive or support. This sort of mental realignment would also play well with the quest to get the job.

Add some sort of interesting mechanic to the DPS rotation and you're off to a good start. Ground or environmental effects would seem appropriate.

[Exstal]

It wouldn't be hard to make a geomancer job.

Summoners and scholars already have different versions of the same spell (summons). Just because a WHM uses all the CNJ spells as-is doesn't mean a GEO can't take a few and switch them to offensive or support. This sort of mental realignment would also play well with the quest to get the job.

Add some sort of interesting mechanic to the DPS rotation and you're off to a good start. Ground or environmental effects would seem appropriate.

It would be good if you went back and read the whole thread instead of clicking the title and hitting "reply".

[Viviza]

It would be good if you went back and read the whole thread instead of clicking the title and hitting "reply".

I can reply to any part of the thread that I want to. There was discussion about how this wouldn't work.

[Kitru]

Summoners and scholars already have different versions of the same spell (summons).

The Summon spells don't change the fundamental effect of the ability. They simply change what is summoned, not what the spell does, which is an entirely different construct from turning Cure into an attack spell. Furthermore, it doesn't change the name of the ability.

Basically, to change the abilities like you want, the devs would basically have to fundamentally change and rename a majority of the class's abilities and traits, at which point they're basically making a new class altogether and not just a job. If they're going to do all the work of making a new class, they might as well *actually make a new class* rather than do all of that work for a single job.

That's the fundamental reason we're not going to see any new job for THM, ARC, GLA, or CNJ: too many of their abilities are solely focused upon their existing role. It completely preempts any new jobs. Even MRD, LNC, and PGL, which *could* get new jobs (PGL and MNK could get tanks; MRD could get DPS) are doubtful because they're not built with multiple jobs in mind like ACN. If anything, it's most likely that any other double job classes are going to be new classes entirely, built with those 2 roles in mind (which also makes sense because you don't suddenly want a horde of 50 DRGs who have only DPSed suddenly becoming 50 tanks without any practice).

[Viviza]

The summon spells DO change the fundamentals. Pets are at the core of the arcanist, and they work differently for each job. Summoners simply follow the arcanist with attack and tanking pets, much like how white mages take all the conjurer abilities as is. But scholars make a departure with core abilities (again, the summons) remapped towards healing.

Conjurers could easily follow the same pattern, but reversed from how arcanists did it. A DPS offshoot like geomancer just needs to swap a couple of the more potent heals away into something else much like how arcanists had their single best DPS tool (the pet) changed. Summoners work perfectly fine with low level healing abilities intact. A geomancer with a similar kit isn't going to break anything.

I'm not saying that they WILL do these things, but they could, and it wouldn't be a radical departure from what's already there.

[Kitru]

The summon spells DO change the fundamentals.

No, the summon spells still summon stuff. The *summons* are different (radically different in the case of SCH), but the spells themselves still do the same basic thing: summon a pet. This isn't the same as changing Cure into an attack. Cure restores hp; it would be a radical departure (re: a full rewrite of the ability rather than changing one aspect of it) for it to suddenly become an attack. That's the point. The devs have said that they can change aspects of abilities with job changes (re: removing high enmity mods from GLA attack if it got DRK as a DPS job, change what's summoned for a given summon spell), but they haven't said anything about replacing an ability with an entirely new one (and, keep in mind, Cure and Cure 2 both have traits attached, so it would be completely replacing those traits as well).

[Giantbane]

No, the summon spells still summon stuff. The *summons* are different (radically different in the case of SCH), but the spells themselves still do the same basic thing: summon a pet. This isn't the same as changing Cure into an attack. Cure restores hp; it would be a radical departure (re: a full rewrite of the ability rather than changing one aspect of it) for it to suddenly become an attack. That's the point. The devs have said that they can change aspects of abilities with job changes (re: removing high enmity mods from GLA attack if it got DRK as a DPS job, change what's summoned for a given summon spell), but they haven't said anything about replacing an ability with an entirely new one (and, keep in mind, Cure and Cure 2 both have traits attached, so it would be completely replacing those traits as well).

It could be a mode change of sorts. Geomancers could have a temporary buff "Corruption" where all their cures turn into attack spells for a limited time. Temporarily harnessing the corrupted elemental forces we see throughout the CNJ quests and what not. The base spell stays the same, just that its function becomes modified by a GEO specific buff.