The Light of the Crystal

[Viridiana]

The Crystals of Light weren't all simply hidden away to be found, we flat out made some (for instance, when Hydaelyn's power ripped the aetheric mist from Garuda and consolidated it into the Wind Crystal).

So, maybe I'm weird in this, but any time we don't get the "disembodied voice" (speech with no bubble) I'm wary of attributing what's going on to Hydaelyn. Not that I don't think she's involved at all, but it feels like it's only during "major" events that she directly acts. Awakening our Echo, setting us off to find the other Crystals, warning us of Lahabrea (twice), saving us from Ultima--these are the type of event where she seems to step in directly. As you'd put it, though, I have no evidence that she *isn't* acting at these other times; I'm just wary of defaulting to the "yes" position.

That said, where the power of the Crystals of Light is certainly. . .intertwined? with Hydaelyn's, I'd have to say that they are separate. After all, it wasn't "By thy deeds will I reveal them to thee," it was "By thy deeds shall the Crystals reveal themselves to thee." That is, the Crystals of Light appear to be distinct from Hydaelyn. As such, I'd have to say that it's the Crystal of Light's power that's ripping the Wind Crystal of Light from Garuda. Same with the Lahabrea fight. Hydaelyn's expended much of her energy just to shield us from the first Ultima cast, and she flat out tells us she can't shield us from a second. While it's possible she's mustering up enough strength to help us defeat Lahabrea, I'd sooner say it's our drawing on the Crystals.

If you are a new adventurer first created in A Realm Reborn, you are chosen by Hyadelyn exactly as you were in Version 1.0: as you come to Eorzea.

Dunno how I forgot that. Interestingly, though, I did just rewatch that scene, and the "star shower" portion never occurs until Chasing Shadows. We don't get a vision of the past (which would be the typical sign of the Echo) until the next quest entirely. Are we certain that the conversations with Hydaelyn are even Echo-based? I always thought the consensus was that the star shower was the sign of awakening to Echo, but I could be off on that entirely.

Now to skip around a bit:

Without this assumption, the rest of your theory becomes a bit of a house of cards.

True, so I might as well address it now. There's certainly a bit of a feedback loop going on, at least inasmuch as we're using the power we've been granted to defeat what we couldn't otherwise, thus gaining even more power. That said, though, I do believe I've made a valid assumption, at least given the information we have:

The power to banish the Darkness dwelleth in the Crystals of Light. Journey forth and lay claim to them.
By thy deeds shall the Crystals reveal themselves to thee.
Only believe, for the Light liveth in thy heart.

And later in the quest Reclamation:

Bringer of Light...
Brave gatherer of the Crystals...thy soul burneth bright!
I am Hydaelyn. All made one.
Hearken unto me now, for the Darkness doth begin to spread.
Ware thee the bearer of the Crimson Brand, for he is the Avatar of Shadow, whom Death attendeth always
The Crystals shall be thy salvation--thy blade and shield both.
Steel thyself, for at the appointed hour...
Thou shalt stare into the Heart of Darkness.
Go with caution, my child, but fear not--for I am ever with thee.

The crystals bear the power, but without the light shining in our hearts, we would still succumb to darkness. The Crystals grant us strength; in strength the light flourishes; the Crystals reveal themselves to the light; the loop goes on. . .

Also, the lines about steeling ourselves to stare into the Heart of Darkness makes me wonder if she isn't basically warning us to never give up hope, because our hope and will are all that keep ours souls alight. That's something of a derail, though.

That they call it an "anomaly in the aether" is indeed strange, but it doesn't necessarily mean that Hydaelyn isn't the source.

I suppose you're right, but I'm not used to things being called anomalies if they have a known source. Hence, I took it to mean something more like, "There's something odd about your aether. Also, Hydaelyn chose you as a champion." As you said, though, it could ultimately go any number of ways.

I don't know if he means our existence (as a person), but the abstract existence of Hydaelyn's Champions, the Godless Blessed in general.

I kinda took it to mean as one awoken to the Echo, but it could just as easily be as the Bringer of Light. Although, if I'm right about our status as the Bringer of Light depending just as much on our hope and spirit as it does on our power, that has interesting implications.

Instead, Hydaelyn's blessing negates the tempering process, infuriating Garuda and making it obvious to her that this is no "mere mortal," but one of the Godless Blessed. The last of her weapons against us is useless - she cannot defeat us martially, and cannot defeat us mentally - and the concept of this is maddening to her.

It is maddening to her, yes, but I still find it interesting that everything about the end of the cutscene says that she's been defeated entirely, that our throwing off her tempering and drawing out the Crystal of Light were just as damaging as all the fighting we did up to that point and then some. I mean, it'd be one thing if her posture were upright and she were raging; instead her posture is broken and defeated, her confidence shattered. It's not until Gaius taunts her that she again rallies. Without that, we've defeated her after she powers up by basically powering up ourselves and completely overwhelming her.

Also, you didn't really touch on whether or not it's the Echo that allows us to absorb the Crystals. Unless you mean to say that they're both ultimately coming from Hydaelyn, but I don't think the Crystals are.

I dunno who brought this up (could have been Moose), but I find the idea that we are tempered very interesting.

I've never actually been fond of this theory. I mean, I see how it could work, and it's interesting to think about, but it leaves a bad taste in my mouth, so to speak. Just, my instincts tell me this isn't the case. I think it's that I'm willing to take the game at its word when it says that the Echo makes one immune to tempering.

[Anonymoose]

they mentioned that some people had 'walked the path' or something to that extent, but basically anyone that had gained enough mastery over the echo eventually saw something so despairing that they more or less gave up on doing anything at all. Sort of curious how *that* fits into anyone's theories.

At the time it mystified me, but knowing what I know now, I think the Walkers saw what Hydaelyn wanted them to - the coming of the Ascians and the inevitable fall of the Sixth Astral Era. Dalamud's descending wasn't part of the original plan, but the Calamity sure was; the final Ul'dah introduction quest was called Calamity Cometh, and the Imperial indoctrination of Ala Mhigan children includes the line, "Calamity is upon thee."

That said, where the power of the Crystals of Light is certainly. . .intertwined? with Hydaelyn's, I'd have to say that they are separate.
<snip>
While it's possible she's mustering up enough strength to help us defeat Lahabrea, I'd sooner say it's our drawing on the Crystals.

This seems quite reasonable. They don't seem to be part of her, just tied to her destiny. What that tie is I'm not entirely sure. The Crystals of Light seem to play their standard role of representing the elements that comprise the world. Hydaelyn, however, seems to be a little like IX's Gaia, the center of our network (however big it is) through which matter, life, and memories pass. If that's actually true, I also don't know. I just kind of took it for granted that Hydaelyn = Crystal of Light (seeing as she's a crystal who uses the word light in every sentence) and the Crystals of Light each represented an aspect of her lifeline. Beyond that I've got few ideas, never mind actual theories. When all else fails, I usually look back to Final Fantasy I - IV, on which Tanaka also worked, and especially III, in which he was the most heavily involved. Those appear to be the "roots" of XIV, and they do tend to line up with a lot of what I was saying before. You're right to question everything beyond that, however. I got nothin'.

EDIT: To add on to what you were saying, perhaps she's mustering up her strength through the gathering of the Crystals of Light, which were widely dispersed, well hidden, and impossible to collect, but are now in the hands of her champion. Perhaps they're kind of like Horcruxes, lol.

Are we certain that the conversations with Hydaelyn are even Echo-based? I always thought the consensus was that the star shower was the sign of awakening to Echo, but I could be off on that entirely.

The same things happen when we see Echoes and speak to Hydaelyn, we kind of zone out and/or pass out. However, that doesn't mean at all that it's Echo-based. That could just be how we experience all aether-related visions. I always had a theory that Damielliot, an Elezen in 1.0 prone to passing out all over the place, was seeing something. Now, the STARSHOWER ... that's a mystery. My theory on that shifts a lot and presently my theory is that it represents the arrival of Ascians in our realm and that it's Hydaelyn's way of saying, "This. This is your enemy. This is bad." Evidence for that? Ascians are here and this one time a Starshower happened just as one showed up. Not a rock solid case, eh? On my to-do list is going through every single main scenario quest and looking for Starshowers, comparing them to Version 1.0's appearances, and seeing if anything stands out.

<many Hydaelyn quotes highlighting the independent status of crystals and our hearts of light>

Tricky thing here is that it can be taken to support any of a number of views; I can't holdfast to it supporting any of them specifically. Again, I just take it for granted that the Mothercrystal of Light would choose a "heart of light" kind of person for the task, and the Crystals of Light would probably resonate with that. Like finds like, or in this case light finds light. We are meant to, after all, bring the Dawn of the Seventh Astral Era, according to the prophecies of Mezaya Thousand Eyes. There might be a deeper connection, and it might be the very one you speculate; I've just thought very little about it beyond the superficial, as "GO TEAM LIGHT!" has basically been the Final Fantasy Classic mantra forever and I assumed it was that simple, lol.

I'm not used to things being called anomalies if they have a known source.

Reminds me of a few cases on 1.0 when we were able to reach into peoples memories and bring stuff back. In Ul'dah we brought back a flower handed out by F'lhaminn, in Limsa Lominsa we brought back a balloonfish left on deck during an aurelia swarm, and in Gridania we brought back a piece of the treant that was so angered by Yda and Papalymo's arrival. Even if you do know the source, being able to touch hearts, speak all languages, and unstick items in time is pretty anomalous.

I still find it interesting that everything about the end of the cutscene says that she's been defeated entirely, that our throwing off her tempering and drawing out the Crystal of Light were just as damaging as all the fighting we did up to that point and then some.

That part I don't find so strange. Primals are made of three components: Aether, Prayers, Essence (and even that Essence part might just be "lots of similar prayers" or perhaps even beliefs and memories passed through the Mothercrystal and added to the Lifestream). The aether part is what comprises the physical being of the Primal and feeds their power. When they fight, they expend that energy, when they die, all that they've consumed is returned to the Lifestream to nourish the land. I also imagine that the Crystals of Light are more concentrated, more pure, and more powerful than any others of their aspect, more pure even than the flawless crystals ritualistically used by the beast tribes at the usual summoning ceremony. Fighting depleted her fuel, but ripping that crystal out of her blew a hole right through the tank.

Also, you didn't really touch on whether or not it's the Echo that allows us to absorb the Crystals. Unless you mean to say that they're both ultimately coming from Hydaelyn, but I don't think the Crystals are.

Only because I have no idea. When we picked them up, we went into one of our visions in Hydaelyn's realm and they became part of that glyph. The NPCs, however, still refer to us as somehow possessing them, as if we could pull them out and juggle them at any time. I don't know if that was a symbolic unlocking of power and they're still in our pockets or what. It could be that we absorbed them, it could be that Hydaelyn pulled them into her realm and combined the rainbow into pure white light to banish the darkness, it could be that I've got them in a little Gym Badge case in one of my many SCH AF pouches. Sadly, I've nothing to contribute on that, so far.

I've never actually been fond of [the theory that Hydaelyn tempered us].

Me, either. I forget who the first to bring that up was. It's a reasonable connection to make, it's just highly improbable given what we know. Primals use tempering as a way to gain worshipers and increase their power. There are no hints so far that non-primals can temper, that the Mothercrystal(s) are similar to primals, or that we are zealously devoted to Hydaelyn. Half the time we just look confused. I didn't seem much more excited about collecting the crystals of light and banishing the darkness than I did collecting ten adamantoise shell for that guy's ... uh ... stamina ... "potion." I'm an adventurer and a job needs doin'. I just happen to have an interesting client and little choice in the matter according to a few thousand year old book that I am in no way qualified to question when it keeps being right about me. Minfilia's way more on board than I am, and she's never even seen her.

At no point do we have any evidence that Titan even does temper, because if he did, the Company of Heroes probably wouldn't have had a chance against him.

I came across some translations of unreleased Version 1.0 quests a while back, and in one of them, the Company of Heroes actually does show up to fight Titan, and he actually does temper the belordofcrags out of them. One minute they're all, "From dust you came and to dust you shall return!" and the next it's, "Friend... Spare us your wrath, benevolent Lord of Crags! We live only to serve you!" As far as I can tell, the trick for tempering is just that the target holds the hell still for a few seconds while being deeply breathed on, which explains why it keeps happening to people being held prisoner. It's like you need to marinate in a good concentration of the haze for a few seconds, which makes sense to me, as it explains why Ifrit isn't just wandering across Thanalan like a 1970s flamethrower with a trail of everyone ever behind him as he marches on Ul'dah.

Also, we're 2/2 on Beast Tribe Quests involving non-tempered beast tribe members trying to save their race and its honor. Kobold and Sahagin come next. We'll have a lot more to go on when we see if the pattern continues.

[Kyan]

Minfilia's way more on board than I am, and she's never even seen her.

She has talked to her, though. We have not seen Minfillia visiting Hydaelyn for a tea party and pep talk yet, but if she can communicate with her, I would not be surprised if she has!

[Nahara]

It's like you need to marinate in a good concentration of the haze for a few seconds, which makes sense to me, as it explains why Ifrit isn't just wandering across Thanalan like a 1970s flamethrower with a trail of everyone ever behind him as he marches on Ul'dah.

I would also venture a guess and say that it's not exactly easy for a Primal to temper someone, either. Consider the whole situation that lead to the fight with Ifrit: the Amalj'aa captured as many people as they could manage and held onto them until it was time to call out Ifrit. If all it really takes is Ifrit breathing on you for a bit to fully temper you, it seems odd that the Amalj'aa would wait at all before taking them to be tempered.

So on top of needing to marinade someone in aether to temper them, maybe takes a bit of charging up before a Primal can attempt to temper someone. Garuda would be an exception due to the fact that her Ixali followers "are legion", as she puts it, and probably can provide her with more power faster.