Scholar and Summoner shared attributes needs fixed!

[Jaq]

I'm a developer too and I'm no stranger to the face-saving "working as intended" line.

The job system "encourages" quick switching between different classes / jobs. If the game is so angled toward playing one character with multiple jobs, why arbitrarily force segregation between two of them?

It's not like it makes practical sense. If I can go from DRG to BRD to BLM and back in 10s, I should be able to do the same for SMN / SCH if I so wanted.

To those using the "well it's one class for 2 Jobs" argument, sure. I would even prefer they got rid of the split and made you level another 50 SCH or SMN independently. At least then you'd be able to work up to having instant (and optimal) switch between what could be two of your favorite jobs.

That's the point. This smells strongly of oversight. If this was game design "working as intended" truly, they wouldn't have shoved ACN on this boat all on its own, but rather presented each class with their own "dilemma."

[ispano]

Well the thing is, they announced they wouldn't use the same stats before we could even play ACN. Threads like this popped up at that time too. They didn't go anywhere either, SE stuck with their decision.

[Jaq]

Well the thing is, they announced they wouldn't use the same stats before we could even play ACN. Threads like this popped up at that time too. They didn't go anywhere either, SE stuck with their decision.

Sure, but that could be for any number of reasons. At the end of the day I don't care to call devs out for what could be laziness or just awkward design choices. At the end of the day they've implemented something in their class / job system design that causes discontent and grinds against the core philosophy this MMO uses as a selling point against others.

I'll leave it at this: I'd be happy with either making you grind to 50 twice for either job, or just getting rid of the attribute point allocations once there are more job "splits."

I kinda agree that ACN shouldn't be able to get 2 50s for the price of one, but I don't like where it's at right now, either.

[casker]

It's all hypothetical. So is your concept that there may, at some point, be a class that won't have this issue, which I personally consider unlikely. I think Arcanist is a preview of what's to come and that every single class will have to deal with this. I think they'll go out of their way to make it happen.

So you think it's more likely that every single job will have stat conflicts, than will there be just one single job that uses the same stat of an existing job.

[Aethaeryn]

Never mind the suggestion of stockpiling The Keeper's Hymn is flawed when it's 10,000 seals for one. I know that's not 'a lot', but it comes out to roughly 40 FATEs in the 40-50 range. I don't know about your servers, but FATEs all but died for higher levels after 2.1 with the exception of maybe 2-3 groups in Northern Thanalan if you're lucky. That still makes most FATEs take anywhere from 5-10 minutes each, so you're looking at upwards of 7 hours to get enough seals to change point allocation once IF there's no weight time between FATEs (there still is even with only a few groups doing them) and if your travel time is almost nonexistent. Never mind that you're also spending gil on repairs then and gaining little out of it if you already have jobs at 50.

Now what if you were trying to play SCH for one endgame group and SMN for another? It's not viable to keep changing your points back and forth. Luckily 30 mind does almost nothing for SCH, but it could make a difference depending on the raid/dungeon for your SMN (not to mention, it's irritating for min/max players). Also, if you try to argue rolling on items in WP or something to trade in for seals, that's not any more time efficient.

Also, they're gonna have to revamp the entire Traits system to be able to make multiple jobs stem from the same class. Otherwise you're going to have classes turning out almost exactly the same, or shared traits even more useless. It works well enough for SCH/SMN because you have completely different pets thrown into the mix, and all of SCH's defining abilities fall under the 5 provided unlocked job abilities. I think it'd be extremely bland to do this with everything and not really the best of ideas. Jobs are cookie cutter enough as is.

[Naberrie]

So you think it's more likely that every single job will have stat conflicts, than will there be just one single job that uses the same stat of an existing job.

Yes. I think they'll make a point of it.

[YeaniNah]

me i wouldnt mind if instead of unlocking stats at lvl 10, it would be at lvl 30 when you unlock SMN you gain stats bonus FOR Smn, when you unlock SCH at 30 you get stat bonus FOR Sch. So when switch to arcanist the stat on Sch or Smn is gonne ...cos only appear on Smn or Sch job. Ain't that better

[Sapphic]

/snip

You know how much difference 30 MND makes? About +15 on your heals. Thats it! That 30 in MND or INT only makes a difference if you min/max. As the difference is minimal at best. Is healing for 1000 or 1015 really going to make much difference?

So dont overestimate the importance of 30 points to call a job "gimped".

[Felis]

On the other hand---

When pugilist gets, hypothetically, let's just say "black belt" for a job, their choices: NONE. Go for STR for monk, and STR for black belt.

Scholar and Summoner are getting gimped. Pugilist and Black Belt wont. This is intentional for you guys and you don't see a problem. Please.

Everyone who played after 1.21 can see that the 2nd job from pugilist could get Int instead of Str

me i wouldnt mind if instead of unlocking stats at lvl 10, it would be at lvl 30 when you unlock SMN you gain stats bonus FOR Smn, when you unlock SCH at 30 you get stat bonus FOR Sch. So when switch to arcanist the stat on Sch or Smn is gonne ...cos only appear on Smn or Sch job. Ain't that better

No stat bonus for the class? The stat bonuses for the jobs are already in the soul stones.

[Sapphic]

You can. I have stats allocated for SMN. I can still play SCH just fine. Heck, sometimes you'll even see a SCH or WHm reallocated points to VIT for turn 5 because the extra mind doesn't make the difference between winning and losing.

Even for Titan, that extra 300 HP with 30 points in Vit can push your HP into the safe zone to cover for any mistakes if you are only in darklight. Aka survivinf eating a bomb, or a plume.