Too many poor DPS

[Jonjon]

. It's hard to be a bad tank.

You clearly have not run into PLDs who only spam Halone. I have run into far too many of those. They never used anything else, well maybe shield throw. Did a prae run and our WHM tanked Ultima, because the tank only used halone.

[Xayoc]

Your experience is clouded by the fact that you'll ALWAYS see more DPS than you will tanks or healers. In my experience, there are more bad healers than their are bad DPS, simply because healing is a bit harder than DPS. A slightly bad healer completely ruins runs (Coil, for example). Not to mention a tanks job is the easiest thing on the planet unless you're in coil/EM primals. It's hard to be a bad tank.

I think Titan HM's DPS check is a little insane, though. Even with a 1 tank 5 DPS setup, I find a lot of groups can't do it without a relic or 2 in the party. Whether this be that those guys don't know how to fully play their class yet, I don't know, it's still a little insane.

Observation: This one finds that it is more about the garbage rotations most DPS use (especially melee). This one clocks 210-240 DPS (using ACT) with a i70 Garuda weapon on BLM, yet it often sees BLMs parse below tanks on HM Titan/EX Primals.

Statement: There are many bads out there, particularly DPS but thankfully parsers root them out very quickly so they can get das boot.

[Milmoko_Gemoko]

Bad DSP combined with back-seat tanking (tellin me what to use in chat, and dictating targets) is my usual gripe.
I had a DSP in Cutters Cry keep marking the adds as 1&2 and telling me to target them - uhuh, needless to say I ignored.
And then DPSs seeing me run as PLD and telling me use WAR skills (and vis versa).
Or the DPS that runs off and grabs groups (usually trying to grab a treasure chest) causing way to much argo for the group, then gets upset they wiped.

Seriously if you wanna play tank and dicate dungeons be a tank class otherwise shut up and follow the leader please

Ended up kicking a guy because I couldnt deal with his ordering the group around and critising everyone last night - oh for record Cutters Cry went a lot quicker after we voted him out, and we didnt wipe after that either

[Vilzen]

It's hard to be a bad tank.

No. No it's not. I've seem plenty of bad tanks. My main is a tank though so I might be a harsh judge.

[Neralyte]

I agree that Titan is seen as somewhat of a check when you're gunning for a relic. It can be slightly unfair to go from never having to worry about DPS checks (because there are practically none until this point) to being slapped in the face with one and immediately follow it up with a rotation that is designed to catch out DPS that are still focusing efforts on their rotations. But it's the players that have nurtured bad habits with FATE grinding etc and turning around and setting disproportionate ilvl requirements that has bred inability to cope with late game content.

[Artemiz]

I agree that Titan is seen as somewhat of a check when you're gunning for a relic. It can be slightly unfair to go from never having to worry about DPS checks (because there are practically none until this point) to being slapped in the face with one and immediately follow it up with a rotation that is designed to catch out DPS that are still focusing efforts on their rotations. But it's the players that have nurtured bad habits with FATE grinding etc and turning around and setting disproportionate ilvl requirements that has bred inability to cope with late game content.

I don't really agree that there aren't any DPS checks before Titan HM, just of the top of my head I can think of The Ultima Weapon in Praetorium (countdown phase) Demon Wall and Ifrit HM's Nails. Then there are the Story mode versions of both Ifrit and Titan. All of those are challenging to a player who is new to the instance.

[Raminax]

I don't really agree that there aren't any DPS checks before Titan HM, just of the top of my head I can think of The Ultima Weapon in Praetorium (countdown phase) Demon Wall and Ifrit HM's Nails. Then there are the Story mode versions of both Ifrit and Titan. All of those are challenging to a player who is new to the instance.

In all honesty, those DPS checks are either very easy to pass or extremely cheesable (Damage Limit Breaks will more often than not completely nullify DPS races until Titan Hard), which gives very little reason to improve for a lot of DPS. At least I've yet to see any failure regarding your examples so far, unless everyone is either AFK or the party completely ignores hitting the Infernal Nail.

[Viridiana]

In all honesty, those DPS checks are either very easy to pass or extremely cheesable (Damage Limit Breaks will more often than not completely nullify DPS races until Titan Hard)

Agreed. Demon Wall tests your ability to do moderate damage while dodging; story Ifrit is doable with a dead dps (if I'm not mistaken); I didn't even realize Ultima Weapon *had* a dps check, it's so light; Ifrit Hard's nails are done with 1-2 LBs; and the sisters in Garuda Hard are almost certainly going to die as long as no player dies first.

Compare that with Titan Hard, where if any of the DPS isn't pulling their weight, has weakness, or has DET down from the gaols, there's a good chance you won't be clearing the heart. Even then, building LB3 early can cover for a lot of weakness in this phase. . .

[Cons]

I agree, ddint feel weak until I completed the main storyline and tried to kill a single nail on Ifrit HM - Im full int and wasnt doing much at all

[Radxen]

Good Gawd, you guys are freaking me out, half the time I read that things are super hard and they end up being super easy.
That being said my main concern was the Demon Wall, I haven't done Titan Hard Mode, but if it's really that much worse than the Demon Wall, I might as well just jump off the edge and end it quickly.
Ran to the Demon wall twice and couldn't get through (mainly cause the black or the white mage kept falling off), ran with a 3rd group and got through the second time cause the black mage LB'd the bees, so I dunno what you guys did that made that fight easy, but our group certainly wasn't doing it.

In short, I'd be nice if people didn't exaggerate :/