Tanks Who Constantly Queue and Then Withdraw Trying to Get in Progress Instances

[LineageRazor]

So it's the tank and healer's moral obligation to "help" others?

Why don't DDs also help others by rolling tanks and healers? Stop demanding others to change, while you don't do anything.

I guess it's easier to just sit back and wish death to our mothers when the group wipes. And of course, blame us when your queues are long.

Who's the selfish party again?

Did you even read my post before typing this? I said it is NOT anyone's moral obligation to help anyone. Your time and mine is valuable, and if you don't want to help someone out, you don't have to. I DO feel it is anyone's moral obligation to hold up their end of the bargain when they strike one. By selecting Roulette, you're agreeing to help people in need. By backing out, you're welching on that agreement.

And, FYI, I AM a tank. AND a healer. Those are my two current jobs. I'm not a DD whining for tanks and healers to bow to my every whim. I'm a human being, who's asking folks to treat other human beings with a bit of respect by not baiting them with completed parties only to back out because they want a quicker reward.

[Grailer]

On top of all that, as folks have mentioned, allowing an "in-progress-only" option WOULDN'T WORK. All the tanks and healers jockeying for an easy run would pile into the "in-progress-only" slot, and none of those people would be available to help out a full run.

But this is happening now anyway. The whole point of this topic is that people are getting annoyed at others constantly withdrawing from que.

By splitting the que you take away the annoying players who keep withdrawing / fishing for in progress runs .

Also what about the players who que and withdraw because they just want to annoy people in general for kicks and giggles ?

I think adding a 5- 10 minute timer between que times would solve that problem

[SendohJin]

On top of all that, as folks have mentioned, allowing an "in-progress-only" option WOULDN'T WORK. All the tanks and healers jockeying for an easy run would pile into the "in-progress-only" slot, and none of those people would be available to help out a full run.

and they would sit there for an hour cause no parties are being formed which means no in-progress run slots will be made. maybe after 15 minutes they would wise up and stop jockeying.

[Archona]

Wow. Could you sound any more selfish, elitist, "ME ME ME" than with that last line?

If a system can be gamed, it will be gamed. Period. If there is a shorter route getting from A to B, a way to save time, then there will always be people who use it. I'm sorry, am I supposed to be running Duty Finder to help all those other people that I'll never see again? Yeah, right. Please continue. Why aren't YOU in Duty Finder queues 24/7 then, if I'm so 'selfish'?

We tanks are not your servants, nor are we obligated to run anybody at anytime.

[Boohiss]

Simply make it where if you withdraw 3 times within 10 minutes, Duty Finder is locked out for 30 minutes. I think that is enough of a penalty to make people not spam withdraw, and at the same time it does not penalize those that need to withdraw for whatever reason once or twice.

[Killance]

If a system can be gamed, it will be gamed. Period. If there is a shorter route getting from A to B, a way to save time, then there will always be people who use it. I'm sorry, am I supposed to be running Duty Finder to help all those other people that I'll never see again? Yeah, right. Please continue. Why aren't YOU in Duty Finder queues 24/7 then, if I'm so 'selfish'?

We tanks are not your servants, nor are we obligated to run anybody at anytime.

I like this guy.

[ApolloGenX]

Yeah, just put a withdraw limit on so that people can't spam it. There's really no reason to be withdrawing more than 3 times within a 5 min period or so.. if you do that, take a 30 min timeout to get yourself situated before going back in DF.

[Ri_ri]

Did you even read my post before typing this? I said it is NOT anyone's moral obligation to help anyone. Your time and mine is valuable, and if you don't want to help someone out, you don't have to. I DO feel it is anyone's moral obligation to hold up their end of the bargain when they strike one. By selecting Roulette, you're agreeing to help people in need. By backing out, you're welching on that agreement.

And, FYI, I AM a tank. AND a healer. Those are my two current jobs. I'm not a DD whining for tanks and healers to bow to my every whim. I'm a human being, who's asking folks to treat other human beings with a bit of respect by not baiting them with completed parties only to back out because they want a quicker reward.

What agreement?
Please, take a screenshot where it says I'm agreeing with anything other than "A high-level/low-level dungeon will be selected at random among those you have unlocked. Succesful completion you earn you far greater rewards". The exact words of what's written there.

Like I said on the other thread, people start creating ideals and rules in their minds, and want to force everyone to obey them.

If you are already a healer or tank, how this affects you in any way? Unless you're telling me DDs are withdrawing on you.

Tbh, the whole thread is complaining for the sake of complaining and trying to force people in their standards. It started as "there's a window in my screen and I don't like it" then became "there's people skipping bosses and I don't like it".

[Davionx]

2 queues is the only real option. All other options only serve to punish the people who need a replacement or those who only want in progress groups. Have the 2 queues but allow people to queue for both if they choose. Win/Win

[YuriRamona]

2. SE already does have incentives for being 'a player in need' <---SE's words not mine.
3. If content isn't being played...or if specific party roles keep avoiding the same content, then SE needs to look at why is this happening and adjust the content/party role so it IS being used.

But the whole 'there's not enough tanks...so if we make it so they can't keep abusing us there will be even less tanks' argument, is faulty at best. The way join in progress can be spammed needs to be changed. If by changing it it now means tanks will refuse to queue for content, then SE will have to solve that. ...but really, tanks won't stop queuing. They believe it or not, need the items too. They are just taking advantage of something while they can. When that option is taken away, they will maybe whine about it for a bit, and then come back in and play with everyone else.

Yes, of course this is all just speculation. Tanks will still join and run CT if you have tons of restrictions and make blind queues, etc. I don't think it's a good idea to do that and not replace it with some other incentive, and neither do you. So we'll just have to hope that SE can come up with something a little bit more innovative than throwing EXP and Gil at a problem to get players to help out. We'll see.

Who said anything about marginalizing players in it for loot? Whether or not you are in it for the loot, you can earn it from where the queue places you, like everyone else. The fact is, you just want to be handed loot for being a desired job. You already receive the reward of being a desired job with instant queues. Stop acting as though blind queues will take away *in progress* groups, because it won't, and will continue to prioritize stranded groups as they come. The incentive is still there, but the ability for a selfish player to queue spam for a run they deem acceptable would not.

Again, you are assuming there is no reward for queuing as a tank, and that there is no penalty for queuing as a DD. Literally instant queues as a tank, while DD sit for literally an hour at times is plenty enough to refute that claim. I am not against other incentives to keep desired classes in queues, but being able to choose which boss you want to start at should not be one. Also, you are completely wrong in assuming tanks will stop queuing if the option of "in progress" is taken away. People are joining queues for a reason, whether it be the gear along the way, or the reward at the end (myth tomes), and that incentive never changes. Tanks still want to myth cap at the end of the week, they aren't going to magically disappear if they can't choose to start at Archeon.

You're right, fishers won't boycott duties just because they got their abusive tool taken away. However, we run the risk that at least some fishers will opt out, and it's impossible for us to know what would happen. It's impossible to answer what would be the impact of a blind queue system so we'll have to agree to disagree. We do need change though and I can agree on that.

You just lost the argument by dropping this one.
Selfishness, bad behaviors and bothering attitude should not, under any circumstances, be rewarded nor encouraged. Ever.

Here is where the issue lies... Needed roles are needed throughout the dungeon, they do not deserve anything more then their fast queue times as compensation.

Fair enough. That's your value. I think that feeding selfish behavior is the only way to get greedy people to be at least sometimes nice. You think that we should distance ourselves from them. I happen to think that SE as a business will never stop catering to the greedy players, but who knows.