Primals Unquestionably Bad

[Teakwood]

As Skies mentioned, they're not really /evil/ as much as control over aether is a zero-sum game; even the more inherently peaceful primals were born out of a wish for protection and certainty in unstable times from their respective beastman races. I mean, Gaius is -completely- correct and has the moral high ground, the only rational thing to do is make all the gods into omelettes and unite all the lands under one banner of civilisation and progress. ...if only the bastard hadn't let himself get schnookered by the Ascians just like everyone else. ;_;

It's also important to bear in mind that the beastmen were deliberately incited to summon their Primals in a fashion -most- conducive to crap spiralling completely out of control by the Ascians. The more rapacious the Primals, the more aether is siphoned away from Hydaelyn and the more power the Primals have to wreak havoc. In a more peaceful, less Ascian infested world, maybe the Primals would be able to get along nicely. ;_;

[PArcher]

Not all the Primals are evil. I'm sure of that.


Ramuh and Titan for sure are not. I'd give Ramuh a Neutral or Neutral Good alignment; he just wants to protect his followers, and really doesn't have any issues with anyone who doesn't threaten his followers (now, I know eventually we'll have to fight him, but it would be really interesting to actually ally with him).
Titan I'd probably give Lawful Neutral; he wants the best for his children (now, I can't tell if the Kobolds are tempered or just following, since we do not see any tempering from him) and is only going after Limsa because they broke a treaty. He's another Primal I'd love to be able to talk to and try to work things out with (no, its not because I hate his fights; I actually enjoy Titan HM a lot and probably will like EX too)
Garuda...is questionable...I'd personally give her Chaotic Neutral, she just personifies that alignment so well. But if she has to be evil, it would be Chaotic Evil (still think CN is better). CN are just completely unpredictable; they can do anything at any time, be calm one moment and fly into a rage the next.
I'd definitely say Ifrit is evil; probably Neutral Evil (Chaotic Evil is also a possibility). He's definitely a bit insecure, sending his followers on raids to get more followers, and seems to just want to gain more and more power, in any way he can, whether to just gain power or to conquer I'm not sure (should finish the Amal'jaa quests first, but that's another week, at least). Definitely evil.
I don't know lore of Leviathan, but based on the Sahagan, I'd likely go with an evil alignment as well...but until we get the story with this Primal and the Sahagan quests...its hard to say. But...Sahagan are 'traditionally' evil, so that's my "base" for now.

As for the Dragons...there was art for Tiamat somewhere...for her to be the Dragon's Primal...would be interesting. Based on the Dragoon storyline, I don't feel that the dragons are wholly evil (heck, I feel that the Dragoons may actually turn out to fight for the Dragons by the end of it)...it may be that Ishgard tried to conquer dragon lands and they're still just fighting back after all these years, or Ishgard split from the dragons or something; I don't know. And maybe Nidhogg is a primal (again, go take a look at the Dragoon story) which means he could be anything.


From the standpoint of the Mothercrystal...all the Primals, are, in fact, bad. Alignment is irrelevant here, since its their very nature that makes them bad. They suck aether out of the lands and that has a detrimental effect on Her, so they need to be destroyed. So from this standpoint (which is what our characters are on), all Primals = BAD. But outside this...they don't have to be, and depending on how our future interactions with the Ascians and Zodiark go...we may ally with some Primals...

[Skies]

it may be that Ishgard tried to conquer dragon land

They didn't try.
Ishgard was a city founded on the divine crusade against dragons. Ishgard was founded right into dravania, the dragon lands.
They did.

[WellFooled]

Not all the Primals are evil. I'm sure of that.

Ramuh and Titan for sure are not.

I don't think we should jump to this conclusion so easily. We literally have no first hand experience with Ramah of any kind and only limited contact with Titan. However even without that experience we know that they both ignore the free will of sentient creatures by enslaving their minds. Even if that was the worst thing they've ever done, that still makes them pretty evil. But it hasn't been the worst, Ramah's followers in particular have been continuing this by trying to temper the Slyphs of Little Solace.

[vientown]

the primals are not bad at all, they protect a populace, they are correct. people see from their perspective, powerful people do too; the primals are right in their world just as we are. to the primals we are unquestionably bad things (tm).

[jomoru]

Look at who taught the beast tribes to summon, its even implied if the same method would have detrimental effects if used to call forth one of the 12. I think its distinctly possible that when interacting with them in a method that doesn't call upon this corrupted influence that the primals might be quite different.

[Skies]

Ah, but WellFooled, Titan's case, at least, is particularly different.
It is very explicitly stated, Titan does not tempers anyone. Which is the only reason the Company of Heroes actually managed to defeat Titan, because he didn't do that to them.
Otherwise, only us chosen by Hydaelyn are able to fight Primals because of that.

[WellFooled]

Ah, but WellFooled, Titan's case, at least, is particularly different.
It is very explicitly stated, Titan does not tempers anyone. Which is the only reason the Company of Heroes actually managed to defeat Titan, because he didn't do that to them.
Otherwise, only us chosen by Hydaelyn are able to fight Primals because of that.

Can you point me to where its stated that Titan doesn't temper his subjects? I'm afraid during my questing I don't remember coming across this info, but then I never played 1.0 either. Granted, I couldn't think of anywhere its expressly said he does either. What I did find was the conversation between Yshtola and the Company of Heroes captain--

Yshtola: Be not so quick to judge. Long have I labored for the well-being of you and yours. And my associate here has bathed in Ifrit's hellfire and lived. Rovec is blessed with a power that protects him from primal influence. Thus was he able to lay low the Lord of the Inferno.

Wheiskaet: A man who can't be tempered? Useful...but it will not be enough.

I guess my argument is why would they even bring tempering up unless Titan tempers? And why would the captain even consider it useful in that case?

[Pentacus]

it's possible that titan shares the same point of view on tempering as garuda, she seemed to treat it at the worst punishment she can give, and was very much aware that it was a fate worse than death, remember that she only attempted to temper you when you REALLY angered her by trying to kill her, she was perfectly happy to just kill alphinaud and cid. the only primal we've seen with a "temper as many as possible" attitude is ifrit, and that completely fits with him being the embodiment of fire since it's natural he'd want to consume as much fuel as possible.

I guess it kind of makes sense, if a primal tempers someone, there is no difference in mindset between a tempered person and a beastman, so they would have no reason to treat them any differently, most likely, the idea of having a non ixal/kobold under their protection would make garuda/titan sick

as for ramuh, I get the feeling like his immediate tempering of the sylphs was a bit of a knee jerk "OMG GUYS! YOU NEED TO STAY WITH ME WHERE IT'S SAFE!", and attempting to temper the other sylphs is an attempt to get them back in the sylphlands and under his protection, frixio even points out that ramuh won't do anything as long as you don't do anything to him or his sylphs (which suddenly makes the sylph faction quests seem like a VERY BAD IDEA)

[Skyhound]

There really isn't even any indication of Hydaelyn being good or the Primals being evil. Hell, we don't even know if the aether being drained from the planet would be such a horrible thing. Most of the denizens in ARR simply assume that because they rely on aether so much. I am personally going to wait an more information to be released, either from the Ascians or the Garleans. I feel like the Garlean Empire has some sort of information on the Primals that we don't have, maybe they know the full effects of Primal influence.