Stop "fixing" the MW scrap it

[Sonic_the_Hedgehog]

There shouldn't need to be compromise over something so basic and fundamental. If you want to waste your time thats fair enough, but it shouldn't be reflected on what other people are doing.
As said above, you guys who enjoy them are absolutely not representative of a majority playerbase, there's even another MW thread on the page totally slating it, you guys just don't seem to be in it because there's no foothold to get hold of.

I never said I represented the playerbase and I didn't know there was another topic, I've just been refreshing this one.

EDIT: Looking at another topic, even Rydin's idea would be good.

[Kailok]

My problem with the MW is not that I have to walk around to them, it's the fact that it's extremely unorganized. When you're buying battlecraft weapons in the Mender's ward, that's a problem. There's no way in hell anyone could call this system "genius", because it isn't. I've never heard anyone say "oh wow, know what's REALLY cool about the MW?"

I've heard people say "I hate it!"
and I've heard people say: "I don't have much of a problem with it"

but never heard anyone say "I love the MW, let me tell you why they're so cool." (And now I fully expect to hear it)

I understand people, like Eldaena, like to browse, and that's perfectly fine. It's awesome that you like to take the time to do that, but that's what letting people setup bazaars is for. They need to have the bazaar system, and then a fixed MW so that you can browse at a counter, or a single retainer, or series of retainers anyway, to quickly find the items you need in an organized space.

I don't mind walking, even though it is a pain. If they let you choose which item you wanted to buy from which NPC, and then only put a star over that specific retainer instead of all of the retainers, then it would work better, but they don't and I have to check every single red star to find the one I wanted.

Also, I don't see how it's Immersive that the Item Search Counter isn't an actual counter, it's just the outside of a zone. I don't see the immersion in looking into the air in front of me to find what I'm looking for. I even LIKE the IDEA of the MW's, I just think it needs to be made more convenient. And btw, for those saying that it takes just as long in XIV as it does in XI, then you most likely don't know how to bid correctly.

I just want something that works. AH or MW, I don't care. As long as it works, is efficient, organized, and convenient, then I'll be happy.

[Eldaena]

My problem with the MW is not that I have to walk around to them, it's the fact that it's extremely unorganized. When you're buying battlecraft weapons in the Mender's ward, that's a problem. There's no way in hell anyone could call this system "genius", because it isn't. I've never heard anyone say "oh wow, know what's REALLY cool about the MW?"

I've heard people say "I hate it!"
and I've heard people say: "I don't have much of a problem with it"

but never heard anyone say "I love the MW, let me tell you why they're so cool." (And now I fully expect to hear it)

I understand people, like Eldaena, like to browse, and that's perfectly fine. It's awesome that you like to take the time to do that, but that's what letting people setup bazaars is for. They need to have the bazaar system, and then a fixed MW so that you can browse at a counter, or a single retainer, or series of retainers anyway, to quickly find the items you need in an organized space.

I don't mind walking, even though it is a pain. If they let you choose which item you wanted to buy from which NPC, and then only put a star over that specific retainer instead of all of the retainers, then it would work better, but they don't and I have to check every single red star to find the one I wanted.

Also, I don't see how it's Immersive that the Item Search Counter isn't an actual counter, it's just the outside of a zone. I don't see the immersion in looking into the air in front of me to find what I'm looking for. I even LIKE the IDEA of the MW's, I just think it needs to be made more convenient. And btw, for those saying that it takes just as long in XIV as it does in XI, then you most likely don't know how to bid correctly.

I just want something that works. AH or MW, I don't care. As long as it works, is efficient, organized, and convenient, then I'll be happy.

See, I agree with you. It would be nice if you can choose which retainer to place a star over. It would also be nice to have more organization, but I'm not sure how they'll do that yet. I think the need to bring in more wards like Battlecraft 1, Battlecraft 2, etc.

Also, retainers are an extended bazaar system, that's why it's market wards and why we have the physical zones to go into. I would like it if they would implement a counter, like some kind of salesclerk that looks over the wards, and can go in and get you whatever item you want to buy, for a small fee for his services. That's what I was thinking.

Edit: I wouldn't even mind people doing bidding and such as an active element to the market in general. I think it would be more interactive and even fun, but still have stagnant marketwards for 'buy now' kind of features. You know?

[Lerris]

My problem with the MW is not that I have to walk around to them, it's the fact that it's extremely unorganized. When you're buying battlecraft weapons in the Mender's ward, that's a problem. There's no way in hell anyone could call this system "genius", because it isn't. I've never heard anyone say "oh wow, know what's REALLY cool about the MW?"

And this is where the real failure comes in.
The organization of the wards does not correspond to the range of activities a real player engages in. All weapons and armor should be sold in the battlecraft ward, but we have other things we want to sell, with their own wards. Since we have fewer retainers than categories of goods to sell, the attempt to add an organizational system to the wards fails. Miserably.

A Market Counter ( I'm not going to call it an AH, because I want to buy gear, not bid on it) would solve a lot of these issues.

[HayaHime]

I like Market wards, it's more better for me than the AH. I can sell 10 items per retainer that's mean more gil's for me, and if we have AH it will be like the old one in FFXI or similar to it with 7~10 slots no more!

[Viridiana]

Hmm. . . I just tried to count the number of retainers in our server's Battlecraft. I figure since Battlecraft is full, then (retainers in battlecraft) x (nuber of wards) should = (maximum number of retainers). Walking very slowly, and erring on the side of caution if I wasn't sure I counted a retainer yet, I counted 181 retainers. Even rounding up to 200, that only allow 3,800 retainers across all wards, or 38,000 items being sold, total, per server. This also means that if the population ever goes above ~1.9k per server, some people won't be able to set retainers at all.

Yes, I know they're about to raise the maximum, but that just (A) pushes the numbers up, and (B) re-introduces MW crashes.

[Viridiana]

I like Market wards, it's more better for me than the AH. I can sell 10 items per retainer that's mean more gil's for me, and if we have AH it will be like the old one in FFXI or similar to it with 7~10 slots no more!

Who says it would be like XI's AH?

[Chezen]

My problem with the MW is not that I have to walk around to them, it's the fact that it's extremely unorganized. When you're buying battlecraft weapons in the Mender's ward, that's a problem. There's no way in hell anyone could call this system "genius", because it isn't. I've never heard anyone say "oh wow, know what's REALLY cool about the MW?"

I've heard people say "I hate it!"
and I've heard people say: "I don't have much of a problem with it"

but never heard anyone say "I love the MW, let me tell you why they're so cool." (And now I fully expect to hear it)

I understand people, like Eldaena, like to browse, and that's perfectly fine. It's awesome that you like to take the time to do that, but that's what letting people setup bazaars is for. They need to have the bazaar system, and then a fixed MW so that you can browse at a counter, or a single retainer, or series of retainers anyway, to quickly find the items you need in an organized space.

I don't mind walking, even though it is a pain. If they let you choose which item you wanted to buy from which NPC, and then only put a star over that specific retainer instead of all of the retainers, then it would work better, but they don't and I have to check every single red star to find the one I wanted.

Also, I don't see how it's Immersive that the Item Search Counter isn't an actual counter, it's just the outside of a zone. I don't see the immersion in looking into the air in front of me to find what I'm looking for. I even LIKE the IDEA of the MW's, I just think it needs to be made more convenient. And btw, for those saying that it takes just as long in XIV as it does in XI, then you most likely don't know how to bid correctly.

I just want something that works. AH or MW, I don't care. As long as it works, is efficient, organized, and convenient, then I'll be happy.

I did state that I loved the wards and why some time ago, but my reasons didn't matter to the "convenience" crowd. It really doesn't matter anyway. When it comes down to it, you really don't have to have a "good" reason to love something, you just do.

I agree with most of your post though. The Wards are disorganized. Someone suggested something about a single npc per catagory, which isn't bad... but it still doesn't allow for actual shops. Part of the problem I think, was that SE expected people to deal in a few certain areas, not all possible crafts. Resulting in huge fleamarkets rather than specific shops.

As for (refering to Wolfie) this not being possible to fix... many innovators were told they were crazy, and it can't be done. Of course, it also depends on what you think can or can't be fixed. If you simply hate the MW altogether, then yes, it can't be fixed for you. However if you like the idea of the MW, scrapping them is not a fix for that crowd.

[Kailok]

See, I agree with you. It would be nice if you can choose which retainer to place a star over. It would also be nice to have more organization, but I'm not sure how they'll do that yet. I think the need to bring in more wards like Battlecraft 1, Battlecraft 2, etc.

Also, retainers are an extended bazaar system, that's why it's market wards and why we have the physical zones to go into. I would like it if they would implement a counter, like some kind of salesclerk that looks over the wards, and can go in and get you whatever item you want to buy, for a small fee for his services. That's what I was thinking.

Edit: I wouldn't even mind people doing bidding and such as an active element to the market in general. I think it would be more interactive and even fun, but still have stagnant marketwards for 'buy now' kind of features. You know?

I agree, I even like the idea of bidding simply because it helps keep from people undercutting all the time. It doesn't stop undercutting indefinitely, but it certainly helps. If you don't know exactly how much the last person put, you're forced to think about it a little bit. Be smart with your money.

I also like the idea you had about using a main NPC to collect all of the knowledge of the wards and buy directly from him/her for a small tax. Would be a great gil sink.

I don't care either way though. I trust SE to decide on something good in the long run. However, my patience in waiting on that something that works is another issue. I don't even sell anything in the MW's simply because it seems so tedious to go find out how much it costs, run all the way to a retainer bell, put something up, go back and make sure it's still the same price. It just seems too ridiculous for me. Maybe it wouldn't be such a big deal if you could summon your retainer directly at the counter.

[AlexiaKidd]

People need to be careful what they are asking for in this thread, alot are screaming for an Auction House but I don't think they actually mean they want a system involving blind bidding or timed auctions. I believe what they mean is they want a menu driven system for buying and selling items, like an expanded version of the Item search feature but the ability to buy straight from the menu without visiting the wards and finding the retainer.

If the devs keep seeing "we want an AH" they may well think we want blind bidding and timed auctions and implement that instead. Of course I could be completely wrong and people actually want that but I get the feeling that I am correct in my assumption.