Stop "fixing" the MW scrap it

[Eldaena]

I think I've explained this at least 40 times in the last month.

Rendering the retainers brought us these inconveniences and problems with MW:

Crashing
Zones and zoning
Penalties for selling in the wrong ward
Inconsistent organization with retainers and wards
Awkward and limited searches
Frustration

Here's a list of things that can't be done with a MW system that doesn't have rendered retainers:

When was the last time you had the wards crash on you? It has been months for me.
The zones are not that bad. I can see why people could get mildly irritated, but it's really not that long.
They wanted to encourage people to sell in the correct ward for the majority of items they want to sell. I agree they need to increase capacity, but you know the tax for selling in the wrong ward is barely a factor. It's miniscule and we need more gil sinks anyway.
I'm not sure about the searches. I think they need to do more in the way of buying and selling searches, but other than that what is the problem? At least we CAN search now, unlike previously.
And I'm sorry that you're frustrated.

[Wolfie]

When was the last time you had the wards crash on you? It has been months for me.

It's been two weeks. More importantly, those crashes would never occur or would be extremely rare with a text based interface. The MW servers, in addition to handling item and transaction information, have to store and process graphics information. It's painfully obvious that it's not a good system if you could have ~100 NPCs in a tight zone, and then tack on a probable ~100 players.

Those are light numbers. Although at this rate I highly doubt it -- if this game ever becomes popular, you're going to have THOUSANDS of retainers and THOUSANDS of people that need to use the market wards, not just the ~600 that exist now. Hardware has limitations. It's not a scalable system.

The zones are not that bad. I can see why people could get mildly irritated, but it's really not that long.

Zoning becomes a problem when 1. you have a big grocery list of things that you need to buy, and 2. if you're playing on a slower machine. It's an overhead that's not very noticeable for one or two item purchases, but when you get to 10+, it becomes a big hindrance.

They wanted to encourage people to sell in the correct ward for the majority of items they want to sell. I agree they need to increase capacity, but you know the tax for selling in the wrong ward is barely a factor. It's miniscule and we need more gil sinks anyway.

Instead of encouraging people and not succeeding, they could have just FORCED items to be automatically categorized. When you no longer have to place your zombie in a zone, the queries that retrieve its inventory no longer needs to check if it's in the right zone or not. Lances will always be found under the "Weapons" category, cloth pieces under the "Weaving supplies" category, etc. The organization structure that's in place right now barely even has an effect; I purchased a Bone Hora from the Clothiers Ward last night and lance from the Mender's Ward. It's stupid and pointless.

I'm not sure about the searches. I think they need to do more in the way of buying and selling searches, but other than that what is the problem? At least we CAN search now, unlike previously.

The search that's available now is bare minimum search functionality. Take a look at what other games' trade searches offer. Freeform text searching, searching between levels, searching based on quality, and searching based on job/class. ALL of this IN ADDITION TO having the drop down menu/menu levels that MW already has. There's also the whole business of having to run back to the entrance to stop searching, and then start a new search if you want a new item. Compare that to just typing in another item's name or browsing the tree menu down to another item and getting them directly from the menu.

And I'm sorry that you're frustrated.

That doesn't even begin to describe my feelings toward the continued support that MW gets, but thanks.

[Eldaena]

It's been two weeks. More importantly, those crashes would never occur or would be extremely rare with a text based interface. The MW servers, in addition to handling item and transaction information, have to store and process graphics information. It's painfully obvious that it's not a good system if you could have ~100 NPCs in a tight zone, and then tack on a probable ~100 players.

Those are light numbers. Although at this rate I highly doubt it -- if this game ever becomes popular, you're going to have THOUSANDS of retainers and THOUSANDS of people that need to use the market wards, not just the ~600 that exist now. Hardware has limitations. It's not a scalable system.



Zoning becomes a problem when 1. you have a big grocery list of things that you need to buy, and 2. if you're playing on a slower machine. It's an overhead that's not very noticeable for one or two item purchases, but when you get to 10+, it becomes a big hindrance.



Instead of encouraging people and not succeeding, they could have just FORCED items to be automatically categorized. When you no longer have to place your zombie in a zone, the queries that retrieve its inventory no longer needs to check if it's in the right zone or not. Lances will always be found under the "Weapons" category, cloth pieces under the "Weaving supplies" category, etc. The organization structure that's in place right now barely even has an effect; I purchased a Bone Hora from the Clothiers Ward last night and lance from the Mender's Ward. It's stupid and pointless.



The search that's available now is bare minimum search functionality. Take a look at what other games' trade searches offer. Freeform text searching, searching between levels, searching based on quality, and searching based on job/class. ALL of this IN ADDITION TO having the drop down menu/menu levels that MW already has. There's also the whole business of having to run back to the entrance to stop searching, and then start a new search if you want a new item. Compare that to just typing in another item's name or browsing the tree menu down to another item and getting them directly from the menu.



That doesn't even begin to describe my feelings toward the continued support that MW gets, but thanks.

I'm not sure what to say. You have several annoyances with it, but to be honest, to me it seems nit-picky. I guess when you are a player of a currently free mmo you feel entitled to certain things, and I hope for you and myself in the future the changes to the MW will satisfy you. If not, I'm not sure what to tell you. I do not think they will get rid of the MW anytime soon.

[Sephr]

I'm not sure what to say. You have several annoyances with it, but to be honest, to me it seems nit-picky. I guess when you are a player of a currently free mmo you feel entitled to certain things, and I hope for you and myself in the future the changes to the MW will satisfy you. If not, I'm not sure what to tell you. I do not think they will get rid of the MW anytime soon.

Is that despite the general hatred seen in game reviews, and the fact that Yoshida's list even says they're reviewing an auction house system?

Seriously, the level of stupidity of the comments supporting the MWs baffle me. Kilta's trying to suggest that it's faster than an auction house (although as someone who says she played 12 hours a day for 6-7 years on FFXI, it's clear she's happy to totally waste her time), and then we have people saying gems such as "Zoning in MWs is a good thing, last I heard people like zoning!"

Literally unbelievable.

Someone had a good compromise earlier, let the people that want to buy their items from the menu be charged double or triple amount the item costs with a percentage going to the retainer owner and the ones willing to buy directly from the retainer get charged the normal amount.

How is that a compromise. People. Should. Not. Be. Punished. For. Wanting. To. Play. The. Game.

Fighting through a shitty ward system isn't what I'd class as playing, grabbing what I need and leaving the city to go kill stuff, is.

I never said double or triple the amount, lol just a shipping tax of sorts. That would be way too high a cost just to buy from the menu.

Honestly I think I'm just going to ignore Sonic, either he's trolling pretty bad, or he really is totally out of touch and unable to look at the situation this game is in remotely objectively.

[Eldaena]

Is that despite the general hatred seen in game reviews, and the fact that Yoshida's list even says they're reviewing an auction house system?

Seriously, the level of stupidity of the comments supporting the MWs baffle me. Kilta's trying to suggest that it's faster than an auction house (although as someone who says she played 12 hours a day for 6-7 years on FFXI, it's clear she's happy to totally waste her time), and then we have people saying gems such as "Zoning in MWs is a good thing, last I heard people like zoning!"

Literally unbelievable.



How is that a compromise. People. Should. Not. Be. Punished. For. Wanting. To. Play. The. Game.

Fighting through a shitty ward system isn't what I'd class as playing, grabbing what I need and leaving the city to go kill stuff, is.



Honestly I think I'm just going to ignore Sonic, either he's trolling pretty bad, or he really is totally out of touch and unable to look at the situation this game is in remotely objectively.

You're very angry. ^^; And it's not punishment, it's convenience at a cost. Just like in real life. And what are you fighting in the wards? Is it that hard to see the red star or the dot on the map?

[Demacia]

You're very angry. ^^; And it's not punishment, it's convenience at a cost. Just like in real life. And what are you fighting in the wards? Is it that hard to see the red star or the dot on the map?

Can't blame him for being angry when people like you and Kilta are posting your crazy posts here (With a hint of rudeness sprinkled into them). Instead of having a convenient system like EVERY OTHER GAME I should have to pay more or be forced to use something that some masochists and people with "unique" tastes prefer? Yeah awesome idea. Game of the year material.

Maybe I should have to pay 1 million gil every time I want to change my controls because GOOD DESIGN COMES AT A PRICE RIGHT?

[Sephr]

Can't blame him for being angry when people like you and Kilta are posting your crazy posts here (With a hint of rudeness sprinkled into them). Instead of having a convenient system like EVERY OTHER GAME I should have to pay more or be forced to use something that some masochists and people with "unique" tastes prefer? Yeah awesome idea. Game of the year material.

Maybe I should have to pay 1 million gil every time I want to change my controls because GOOD DESIGN COMES AT A PRICE RIGHT?

You should only be able to run at top speed for a couple of minutes, then have to walk for a while because that's what real life is like. If you want better than that, there's a nasty tax for some magic boots.

[Eldaena]

Can't blame him for being angry when people like you and Kilta are posting your crazy posts here (With a hint of rudeness sprinkled into them). Instead of having a convenient system like EVERY OTHER GAME I should have to pay more or be forced to use something that some masochists and people with "unique" tastes prefer? Yeah awesome idea. Game of the year material.

Maybe I should have to pay 1 million gil every time I want to change my controls because GOOD DESIGN COMES AT A PRICE RIGHT?

Raging too, I see. ^^; Do you agree there is a lot of gil in circulation in this game? I wasn't thinking it wouldn't cost as much to tax an instant transaction as Sonic thought, but are you really that against this idea? It's what you want, but not as easy as you wanted it so you're yelling at me?

I'm not crazy, I'm trying to be a mediator. I want everyone to be happy and for things to be fair.

[Wolfie]

Can't blame him for being angry when people like you and Kilta are posting your crazy posts here (With a hint of rudeness sprinkled into them). Instead of having a convenient system like EVERY OTHER GAME I should have to pay more or be forced to use something that some masochists and people with "unique" tastes prefer? Yeah awesome idea. Game of the year material.

Maybe I should have to pay 1 million gil every time I want to change my controls because GOOD DESIGN COMES AT A PRICE RIGHT?

Come on man, everyone know that the only way to fix a system that's very complex, unintuitive and limiting is to ADD MORE COMPLEXITY, OPTIONS, AND PENALTIES.

[Sephr]

You're very angry. ^^; And it's not punishment, it's convenience at a cost. Just like in real life. And what are you fighting in the wards? Is it that hard to see the red star or the dot on the map?

Not really angry, it's just frustrating that people seem to enjoy the crappy system, and would continue to try and argue it should be in despite such overwhelmingly negative feedback and it being cited as one of the main reasons by reviewers that the game sucks.

If these forums are the place the majority of feedback is being taken from, that's not likely to change.

I don't see where you're getting this idea from that I find the market wards challenging? You're right, it's not hard to find a stupid red star. The point is, it's also not convenient to have to go find it. I should be able to buy something off the list, the act of having to zone 2+ times to get what I want is just unbelievably stupid, which is precisely why the game bombed so hard. Stupid decisions like that.

I just don't get the positives, what are they? Where are they?

There's no 'immersion' factor in a bunch of lifeless NPCs stood in a gloomy room together, what does it add to the game experience for you people?