Final Fantasy XIV Auto-Attack Video

[kukurumei]

What do you think a GCD is? Any action creates one, AA, Spell, ability. I guess i should have been more specific but figured the general population would understand. My bad.

Better put if AA creates a GCD it 'could potentially' kill people since mages would have to wait that extra bit to THEN cast which by then could be to late. If that helps you understand better.

In other words you mean animation delay. Which is a picky and almost insignificant timing issue. The Time for animation delay of a "swing" is so low that you might as well say "lag killed you" instead of "my AA animation killed you".

A spells will always supersede the "swing" unless the "swing" came right before you cast, and the likely-hood that that's actually a critical point in the battle is so low, it's inconsequential.

Unless you make FF14 play like some WoW raids, where one-shot-ing is a par for course...never going to be a problem.

Monsters themselves don't attack at the speed of light for it to matter. FF11 is even more harsh and veteran DRKs are mighty accurate in their stun timing.

[wind]

In other words you mean animation delay. Which is a picky and almost insignificant timing issue. The Time for animation delay of a "swing" is so low that you might as well say "lag killed you" instead of "my AA animation killed you".

A spells will always supersede the "swing" unless the "swing" came right before you cast, and the likely-hood that that's actually a critical point in the battle is so low, it's inconsequential.

Unless you make FF14 play like some WoW raids, where one-shot-ing is a par for course...never going to be a problem.

Monsters themselves don't attack at the speed of light for it to matter.

I wouldn't call it insignificant, perhaps for current fights, since nothing is exactly 'challenging'. But take for example a fight where it was healing intensive and in between a Cure to a Sacrifice your healer has the added downtime of an AA swing 'animation'. Trying to think of a decent XI example of a high intensity healing fight with not just tank damage but AoE damage to your melee's. But been a while and drawing a blank ; ; sorry .

PW was more melees needing to not be stupid so I wouldnt say it was that healing intensive. Jorm would be a decent example when it first came out but meh not what I'm trying to get across.

I guess somthing such as the healer basically had to keep spamming cure > sac > cure > sac just to keep melee/tank up.
Now add AA ontop of it.
Cure > AA > Sac > AA > Cure. It could potentially kill people due to that GCD building up.


This is ofc with the assumption SE actually brings in such challenging content(healing intensive/DPS race/Tank Swapping etc). If everything stays simple as it currently is then you're correct that AA wouldn't bring much harm.

[Nikelz]

"close comabt range" I'm sory but I will not be walking up to something like Uraeus and melee as a mage. This means mages will no longer have the damage from their darts and no longer will be able to build TP and use WS that have enfeebling skills. To make up for the damage mages will have to cast more, but without a refresh... they will not be able to contribute to party damage as they used to. Tell me how will battle regimens work now if you aren't able to control your attacks? Will they be getting rid of regimen of ruin and the like? There are too may unanswered questions and as it stands now implementing auto attack without those other changes will just gimp the game just in time for new content to come out. How much more frustrating can these empty changes get?

[kukurumei]

I wouldn't call it insignificant, perhaps for current fights, since nothing is exactly 'challenging'. But take for example a fight where it was healing intensive and in between a Cure to a Sacrifice your healer has the added downtime of an AA swing 'animation'. Trying to think of a decent XI example of a high intensity healing fight with not just tank damage but AoE damage to your melee's. But been a while and drawing a blank ; ; sorry .

PW was more melees needing to not be stupid so I wouldnt say it was that healing intensive. Jorm would be a decent example when it first came out but meh not what I'm trying to get across.

I guess somthing such as the healer basically had to keep spamming cure > sac > cure > sac just to keep melee/tank up.
Now add AA ontop of it.
Cure > AA > Sac > AA > Cure. It could potentially kill people due to that GCD building up.


This is ofc with the assumption SE actually brings in such challenging content(healing intensive/DPS race/Tank Swapping etc). If everything stays simple as it currently is then you're correct that AA wouldn't bring much harm.

I think you're drawing parallels to the current system, which has manual input lag. AA if done even half correctly, does not have input lag because it's essentially a system function.

The input of a "skill" going right after a "swing" animation is very small. Less then a fraction of a second, well within tolerance. There is going to be an animation delay, but it's very very small, because it's going to get motion blended into your "skill" function.

and in your situation, it would never happen. "Cure > AA > Sac > AA >" would not happen unless you purposely made it happen. It would end up "Cure >Sac [ got superseded AA] > AA > > AA"

Because Cure -> sac is already inputted before the cure competition, the system will bump the AA priority down. You're don't need to time a sacrifice right after cure ends.

The concept of Stacking or "buffering" is already a known entity.

Another reason for stamina gauge removal. You don't have a "check stamina requirement" after every skill input to prevent stacking.

[Shikyo]

I think you're drawing parallels to the current system, which has manual input lag. AA if done even half correctly, does not have input lag because it's essentially a system function.

The input of a "skill" going right after a "swing" animation is very small. Less then a fraction of a second, well within tolerance. There is going to be an animation delay, but it's very very small, because it's going to get motion blended into your "skill" function.

and in your situation, it would never happen. "Cure > AA > Sac > AA >" would not happen unless you purposely made it happen. It would end up "Cure >Sac [ got superseded AA] > AA > > AA"

Because Cure -> sac is already inputted before the cure competition, the system will bump the AA priority down. You're don't need to time a sacrifice right after cure ends.

The concept of Stacking or "buffering" is already a known entity.

Another reason for stamina gauge removal. You don't have a "check stamina requirement" after every skill input to prevent stacking.

AA wont cancle a skill...

[wind]

I think you're drawing parallels to the current system, which has manual input lag. AA if done even half correctly, does not have input lag because it's essentially a system function.

I'm taking into account this current system yes, as well as XI's system(both done by Matsui). Both will/have AA and in XI the GCD actually occurred AFTER the spell was used and was a horrible 1-1.5secs.

Also you're right my example was indeed being a bit presumptuous saying AA WILL sneak in both times. Which it wont the majority of the time if a person times the spell correctly. But that's not to say it will never happen also.

If AA is triggered and a spell is done roughly at the same time, you're correct the spell will supersede AA but as soon as that cast is done, AA will finish(if AA doesn't reset timers, which majority of games it doesn't).

[kukurumei]

If AA is triggered and a spell is done roughly at the same time, you're correct the spell will supersede AA but as soon as that cast is done, AA will finish(if AA doesn't reset timers, which majority of games it doesn't).

That's why a skill will buffer another skill. Just like SATA in thfs or any number of skill stacking we're so used to.

You don't need to time one spell -the instant- after another, as long as it's done within a similar period, the CureI will buffer into cureII will buffer into cureIII until you're out of spells, which then AA will proc.

Then there's the "mashing" trick, we're also used to doing. if you are casting cureIV and spam stun button, the stun will always go right after your cureIV. AA will never proc because the system is registering an overiding skill.

I just don't see a situation except in the extreme case where AA will get in the way. It'll have to be dumb luck that at the exact moment someone needs that spell/skill ASAP, AA gets in the way out of nowhere. (The old crap SATA mess up - haha try jamming it)

[wind]

That's why a skill will buffer another skill. Just like SATA in thfs or any number of skill stacking we're so used to.

Ya but most of the time THF's would wait for the AA to finish and do it in between the swing timer so that it wouldnt hurt. For most 'skill stacking' thats also true. You wait for the AA to finish THEN do your rotation (SATA Dancing Edge :P).
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Rofl this all started with mage(range) should/shouldn't get AA. So guess we should just conclude this before we keep going in different tangets haha.

Seems like we both have good points and we both cant be sure as to how the new system will work. If its laggy like now then I still believe that Ranged AA wouldn't be that justified.

If they fix up the lag issues since it appears they were talking about server upgrades and core programming etc in a couple Mod posts then having Ranged AA wouldn't be a harm you're right.

Also don't see the actual "need" for them to have it but it would be a moot point since it wouldn't harm anything either.