The problem with allowing Turn 2 Rage strat

[Nash20]

To be honest, now that I read back on what I wrote.

I want these same ppl severely protesting T2 enrage methods lead the charge against having everyone have ranged DPS for Garuda and Ifrit EX!

Same sh*t, ppl are getting locked out of content because of their jobs for an "easy win"

OH WAIT...that would mess with their progression, nevermind...this thread is for locking out people they don't deem worthy...I get it.

[Sapphic]

While designing fights to be tackled using multiple methods definitely is a good thing, common sense tells you that the enrage strat was not on the list methods, that SE designed this fight for.

The enrage timer was not designed for people to go on a cigarette break to deliberately wait for its expiration. The debuff on the tanks was put in place so bringing 2 tanks (as required by the usual party setup) actually makes sense, as the debuff requires tanks to swap emnity. You think the beduff was put in place for people to say "Well, lets just not pull until the last click has begin, so the debuff doesn't stack too high on the tank?

Riddle me this:

If ADS wasn't supposed to be able to be killed while enraged why didn't SE make enrage a one shot mechanic?

[Vodomir]

I want these same ppl severely protesting T2 enrage methods lead the charge against having everyone have ranged DPS for Garuda and Ifrit EX!

I guess your "everyone" is the same bunch that relies on Enrage mode for T2? Because people that know how to deal with given mechanics rather than to circumvent them, also know ho to do Garuda/Ifrit with a melee setup.

Same sh*t, ppl are getting locked out of content because of their jobs for an "easy win"

Please forgive me, but if I'm not mistaken, the people looking for an "easy win" are actually the guys who are trying so hard to defend the enrage strat (incl. you). I'm really sorry to disappoint you, but my FC does Garuda with 2 melees and I can't see an issue running this with 4 melees. Not soo sure what is supposed to lock us out of content.

Riddle me this:

If ADS wasn't supposed to be able to be killed while enraged why didn't SE make enrage a one shot mechanic?

Because the fight was neither designed for people in full iLvl 90 gear nor for people bringing 3 healers and pulling in a way that the tank doesn't get too many stacks of the debuff.

The Enrage doesn't one shot the group to give people who fail to meet the enrage timer some margin for error. So if you only miss the enrage timer by a few seconds, you can still win, because the damage dealt by the room can be healed through for a short period of time (given the fact that the group runs a regular setup, isn't geared up to the teeth and played this encounter as intended before the enrage set it, so healers are nowhere near full mp at this point). Enrage "strat" just exploits the fact that this was designed to give weaker groups some margin, by playing mp song from the beginning, having no one but the tank even risk to eat damage, having the tank pull extremely late (so he doesn't build up on stacks) and then either bringing 3 healers or 2 extremely well geared healers.

[Sapphic]

Because the fight was neither designed for people in full iLvl 90 gear nor for people bringing 3 healers and pulling in a way that the tank doesn't get too many stacks of the debuff.

That's your opinion, based on nothing but your opinion. Unless you are privy to being in communication with the designers and they told you personally....
My points are backed on evidence from an official post. What are yours based upon?

SE said it is NOT an exploit, that it WILL NOT be changing. Hence they say it's a valid tactic. If they didn't want people to do this way they would specifically state not to do this way as they did when they said about mobs bugging out and for jumping in PvP.

BTW nowhere in the fight does it mention enrage... The players labelled it as enrage.

[RickXRolled]

Sigh, all this talk between elitists and casuals about enrage method being legit or not.
It' s blatantly obvious the enrage method was a design flaw. It was intended to pretty much wipe a group doing it the normal way if they lacked the dps to kill it intime. They simply overlooked the fact you could wait for the enrage first before fighting. Instead of fixing it and making all the casuals cry out en masse because they can never down turn 2 again, they simply said: "Whatever, let them do what they want for now. We learned our lesson from this and will make sure that in future encounters this method can' t be used.".

So, while casuals might feel like the developers said:" Go ahead guys! We support your method!" they actually reluctantly allow it and see it as a learning experience for future encounters.

For those still claiming SE intentionally made it this way.This is the way it is based on logic. There is a difference between a design flaw/oversight and an exploit, hence they can' t call it exploiting. The fight works 100% as scripted after all.Turn 2 was made by human beings, human beings make mistakes.If you have allagan rot active when you get hit by the enrage aoe it detonates, meaning you wipe. If you clear all nodes the boss will have allot of damage resistance and hasted voltage. Never once did they think to themselves people might wait till the last minute and heal through the aoe. People who claim they intentionally made it this way basically have their brain justifying their use of the enrage method.(All our brains justify our actions to ourselves one way or another.)

[Ashira]

For those still claiming SE intentionally made it this way.This is the way it is based on logic. There is a difference between a design flaw/oversight and an exploit.

Some people say it's an exploit, design flaw or an oversight; others will say it's working as intended. The fact is that SE have no intention to change it, because they do not deem it as broken, and SE have the last word.

You might not like that, but that's too bad. You can't have everything you want and some people enjoy using this method.

[Lordfurious]

SE I sincerely request you adjust Turn 2 to force players to actually work through the mechanics of this fight.

Why stop at Turn 2 then? Chimera you can use the hill to negate the damage, and Sunken Temple of Quarn you can use the ruble height difference to negate doom on ranged. Is there something in particular that upsets you with Turn 2? Are you replaced with a healer? I just do not understand why this is only about Turn 2. There are many dungeons where you can skip trash or find a more clever way to do it, like enrage.

[Spearit]

Riddle me this:

If ADS wasn't supposed to be able to be killed while enraged why didn't SE make enrage a one shot mechanic?

Me me !! i have an answer and it's a riddle too!!
Why did they have to deal with server problems when they release ff14?? Because they can make mistake.

To Nash20. I agree with you but here there is a design problem of the fight. The second tank is useless in the fight. If you don't take him in your party it won't end up skipping a mechanic.
T2 enrage mode, is in my opinion, a really lame strat to use because. In my opinion th most interesting in the game is to succeed in the challenges. If you skip the end game content what is the point of playing ff14.

This be say, i don't really care about people using this cheat. And a simple way to correct this is to make the enrage damage enhance. This will allowed new party to have an extra time to kill ads. And the enrage mode strat won't work anymore.

[Vodomir]

And a simple way to correct this is to make the enrage damage enhance. This will allowed new party to have an extra time to kill ads. And the enrage mode strat won't work anymore.

Actually the best solution would be to let the ADS continue to use all of its regular attack pattern even after enrage sets in. This way people would be forced to learn how to deal with the actual mechanics of this fight.

[Spearit]

Actually the best solution would be to let the ADS continue to use all of its regular attack pattern even after enrage sets in. This way people would be forced to learn how to deal with the actual mechanics of this fight.

Maybe, don't really know, i never saw the enrage in this turn and don't know exactly how it work!
i took like one aoe the first time i down the t4 and i have to say that it was really fun to succeed in the hurry (that's why i think enrage shouldn't be an instant wipe, but it's just my opinion)