The problem with allowing Turn 2 Rage strat

[One_WingedAngel]

I am sure the rage streatgy is making the developer cry.

[Sigvaldus]

This type of subject, always brings out the elitist's, your not impressing anyone just because you can beat turn 2 by doing it the more difficult way.

[Vodomir]

This type of subject, always brings out the elitist's, your not impressing anyone just because you can beat turn 2 by doing it the more difficult way.

No one is trying to 'impress' someone, as the mechanics are easy enough to be dealt with the intended way. By using the enrage mode you don't 'beat' the encounter, you merely circumvent all of its mechanics completely. You just show off that you or the group you run with are largely incompetent of dodging a few void zones and passing along rot in a given pattern (where you don't even have to pass it at all, if all just stack up behind the ADS after the initial round of passing around the rot; the immunity timers will take care of passing along the rot automatically) - much more impressive. Let me ask again, where's the benefit of using the enrage mode, if not for making up your own shortcomings in how to deal with the regular mechanics? Enrage Mode takes longer than a regular kill and requires the raid group to leave coil after turn 1, have 1 or more people change classes/characters, an re-enter the coil, just to do the whole leaving and class changing thing again for turn 4.

[Shirai]

You know that you can easily change jobs in the "waiting areas" between the turns, right?

[Vodomir]

You know that you can easily change jobs in the "waiting areas" between the turns, right?

No, didn't know that, because honestly, we play the entire raid with the same setup we enter Turn 1 with, never had to resort to class changes so far. And while changing classes in the waaiting area may be possible, this will not work if the said class is on another toon (not everyone has all of their classes levelled on the same toon).

[Allyra]

No, didn't know that, because honestly, we play the entire raid with the same setup we enter Turn 1 with, never had to resort to class changes so far. And while changing classes in the waaiting area may be possible, this will not work if the said class is on another toon (not everyone has all of their classes levelled on the same toon).

Are you seriously advocating engrage strat is bad because some people may have multiple toons?

How is this in any way shape or form relevant to the topic?


If people who are doing it have no issue and it doesn't affect you in anyway, why does it matter?

[Vodomir]

Are you seriously advocating engrage strat is bad because some people may have multiple toons?

How is this in any way shape or form relevant to the topic?


If people who are doing it have no issue and it doesn't affect you in anyway, why does it matter?

Did you even care to read any of my previous posts in this thread? If you did, you will probably notice, that I don't have any issues with people using this so called "strat" neither do I demand any change to encounter to disallow said "strat".

I'm simply not using this "strat" myself and also recommend others to not use it for a various number of reasons/disadvantages:

- it leaves a bad taste in your mouth, because winning with this "strat" just doesn't feel right, as you didn't even handle with just one of the fight's core mechanis in the intended way; all you do is merely bypass/circumvent all of the mechanics - what an accomplishment!
- players who never did this the intended way will learn absolutely nothing about the actual mechanics; they don't even learn how to deal with game mechanics in a proper way; all you show them is how to look for ways to bypass game mechanics (so while not officially an exploit, you are at least entering a grey zone of "non intended gameplay")
- if you ever want to become a member of any serious raid fc, than it certainly won't help your reputation, if all you did in Turn 2 was Enrage Mode
- enrage mode is basically a huge waste of time, as clearing it the intended way is clearly faster (not only because of the hassle you might have with switching classes/toons, but because the fight is won clearly before the clicks run out, whereas in enrage mode you first start to DPS seriously only after the clicks have run out

I don't see any advantage of using the enrage mode other than to either make up for your own incompetence to even deal with relatively easy to handle game mechanics or to carry loads of noob player to auto victory in this turn. Either way using enrage mode only shows that you are not even on par with an average raid group, as this turn isn't even remotely hard to begin with.

[Allyra]

- it leaves a bad taste in your mouth, because winning with this "strat" just doesn't feel right, as you didn't even handle with just one of the fight's core mechanis in the intended way; all you do is merely bypass/circumvent all of the mechanics - what an accomplishment!

For you it leaves a bad taste, not for everyone.

- players who never did this the intended way will learn absolutely nothing about the actual mechanics; they don't even learn how to deal with game mechanics in a proper way; all you show them is how to look for ways to bypass game mechanics (so while not officially an exploit, you are at least entering a grey zone of "non intended gameplay")

So?

- if you ever want to become a member of any serious raid fc, than it certainly won't help your reputation, if all you did in Turn 2 was Enrage Mode

If you ever want to become a member of a serious raid fc, practice doing it the legit way first. No one is forcing you to do enraged. Also, you assume no serious raid fc does enraged.

- enrage mode is basically a huge waste of time, as clearing it the intended way is clearly faster (not only because of the hassle you might have with switching classes/toons, but because the fight is won clearly before the clicks run out, whereas in enrage mode you first start to DPS seriously only after the clicks have run out.

Again for you, some decide to have that be their break time instead of after the fight. Not everyone considers it a waste of time.

I don't see any advantage of using the enrage mode other than to either make up for your own incompetence to even deal with relatively easy to handle game mechanics or to carry loads of noob player to auto victory in this turn.

Or because people aren't that obsessed with the game so would rather just be able to relax and chew the fat on vent if given the opportunity.

Either way using enrage mode only shows that you are not even on par with an average raid group, as this turn isn't even remotely hard to begin with.

Again, huge assumption that if you do enrage it means you can't do it the other way. The normal way is easy, the enraged way is even easier. Some people are always going to go for the easiest, even when they can do both.

After doing turn 2 the legit way over and over and over again, it loses its appeal as it's redundant. There is no motivation anymore to do it the normal way for some people if it means they can do it an even easier way. The group already knows they can do it the normal way as they have done it a million times. They don't have to keep proving it to themselves.

Just because there are no advantages for you, doesn't mean the advantages are only for "bad" players.

[3motion]

Tanks love T2 Enrage, solo loots

[Ricon]

I'm a little curious why people keep saying using enrage hurts users skill in turn 4. Those turns are in no way, shape, form, or fashion alike. Turn 2 requires killing a varying number of nodes to lock abilities/ give buffs to a boss which you then kill. Turn 4 is nothing more than a timed dps check where you kill waves of enemies until you win or lose more like a hard mode demon wall. Kinda. Sorta. You get the idea.

I feel like blocking rot and giving ADS haste is the real hard mode, dude is a pain like that.

Try to just live and let live for a change since SE has said this isn't an exploit (gonna blow your mind in a second). I would like to note here that no encounter other than the two ADS fights have a timer counting down to its(wait for it, I'm gonna blow your mind here) CHANGE IN MODE. This is not a rage in the same sense as twintania or turn 4 and antabooga/the primals are not rages either (those are dps checks). Ultima is not a rage, that's a clock. Instant death after a set time has expired is a clock, difficulty increases after a timer has expired is a rage. They are more often than not a wipe but can still be won at times as proven with twintania. ADS simply changes modes to something that is harder/easier for some set ups.

(This is a disclaimer stating that I have done turn 2 both ways and I support no side in this argument other than SE) /threadover /mindblown /playthegamethewaythatmakesyouhappyanddoesntsteponotherstoes.