Griefing & Party Kick Abuse

[KupoSan]

So, I ran into this issue today. I'm sorry if it's been brought up, but I spent 10 minutes trying to find where to place this and where it might be located. I found other threads about "party kick abuse," but this one is different.

I was in a Titan EX Duty Finder. A certain Individual claimed he knew the fight, and he won it on his alt. Throughout the whole fight, he was performing horribly and hurting the group. We all talk to him about it, and then he says, "Kick me, I have to go. Time to do Ifrit EX." Well, this guy has made a fool out of himself, and at this point we don't want to kick him. We advise him to take the 30 minute penalty.

This Individual then goes to to pull Titan and wipe the whole group over and over until we would kick him. Here's where the problem is: People who don't want to take a 30 minute penalty, but they want to leave the group, can openly grief people until the party gets so upset they kick them. Thus they don't receive a penalty.

This isn't fair. I reported him to a GM, and we also eventually kicked him after he MPK'd us about 3-4 times. But, this is a clear abuse of the system. Is there not some way to combat this? How should I go about handling this situation next time?

For the record, he did seem to be a child, cussing and talking like he had no idea what he was talking about.

[tOnni3]

You can do nothing but kick him out and report.

[Hiroradius]

Nothing you can do, the kick system needs to penalize the people being kicked, but if you do that then people will start kicking to be jerks, but if you don't then you get what you just had. Now if he kept pulling Titan and doing that, honestly I would have stayed dead and waited for him to leave.. I can be a jerk too lmao, would have got up, got a drink, come back he's still there, talk in FC, tab out and rewatch a video on the fight, etc etc.

[Delorean]

Continue not giving a crap?

I can't believe people still don't realize abandoning a group prevents them from queuing for content. It does not prevent others from queuing them into content. At least in the last build it did.

Should have shown them how much of a difference they were really making imo :|

[StarHate]

I don't get it. Why didn't you just kick him out? Spite? You thought he deserved the 30 minute debuff? Either way he would have been gone and him having or not having a timer lock would have 0 impact on your group. Sounds like you were griefing yourself; unless I misread something?

[Holyhunter]

I don't get it. Why didn't you just kick him out? Spite? You thought he deserved the 30 minute debuff? Either way he would have been gone and him having or not having a timer lock would have 0 impact on your group. Sounds like you were griefing yourself; unless I misread something?

It's not necessarily applicable to Titan EX due to the small party size, but we've had people like the person Kuposan is talking about able to instantly queue back into our CT group. They SHOULD be getting a 30 minute debuff for two reasons. A) They should not be able to instantly queue into another group and just ruin their chances at a kill and B) On the off chance they do queue back into your group (which is a possibility) that has a clear impact on your group and it means that whoever initiated the vote kick wasted that vote.

[StarHate]

It's not necessarily applicable to Titan EX due to the small party size, but we've had people like the person Kuposan is talking about able to instantly queue back into our CT group. They SHOULD be getting a 30 minute debuff for two reasons.

Kicking them out is the punishment though..... asking for FURTHER punishment makes you look petty. Add a 30 min timer to kicked players and then you will see the real griefing begin. I see your point about re-entry and would agree that a kicked player shouldn't be able to re-enter the same group, but once they are out.... who cares? You want SE to send a rep to their house and kick them in the balls too? Removing them from your group is recourse enough.

[Holyhunter]

Removing them from your group is recourse enough.

that's the issue though. Kicking them does not necessarily mean that they will be removed from your group. They can instantly queue back in and you may be stuck with them AGAIN.

[HEC]

but once they are out.... who cares?

Erm - another 5 - 20 groups such moron will join and ruin the run for after yours? Look at it other way - if another group kick the moron and you'll get it in your group - how would you feel? Would you not prefer him / her to be grounded for a half hour instead?

[StarHate]

Erm

But that isn't what happened. You are trying to lay out a worst case scenario to make the argument work. Let's say we change it and there is a 30 minute debuff timer added to vote kick. Do you know how much these forums will explode from people griefing others with it? DPS kicking tanks at the end of a run to spite them out of the queue? Zenith groups vote kicking out members in DF who say no to speed runs? People just generally being tools and forcing the debuff timers on others?

You know what I would do? Vote kick them out. Done. The OP even said he knew he was being petty by wanting to debuff the guy and not just kick him out. That seems like a good way to develop policy to you? You guys really need to think about the big picture here, not knee-jerk reactions. As someone else mentioned, the more strict this stuff becomes to "protect" people, the more abuse begins to skyrocket.