FATE Grinding = Not learning?

[Grundy]

I've been leveling up Arcanist by mixing dungeons and looking for FATEs that people generally ignore so it's only myself solo, or a few others - it's helps tremendously. When I leveled MNK through Coerthas and N Thanalan in FATEs it felt like my eyes were bleeding. 2.1 and increased dungeon XP will be interesting, I did Satasha the other night and was the only person clicking the bubbles on the final fight, I don't think the others knew or cared. Of course, I wasn't quick enough to keep all four drains covered so it ended up a massive zerg race and frantic tank healing. I hope it gets better.

[amnie]

whm solo-fating:
I throw stone at a mob.
if I dare to heal someone, I INSTANTLY have 10 mobs on me that they aggroed besides the 'target mobs' (or the boss of the fate) and they don't even bother attacking them, meaning for the rest of the fate I will be busy trying to survive on mobs that aren't even part of the fate...

whm group-fating:
medica spam




yeah. no thanks.

[PArcher]

You also have to remember alot of melee DD's have positionally effective skills, NONE of which most DDs realize even if theyre doing Qarn or Stone Vigil. I can't count how many DDs and Tanks ive PuG'd that didnt know how overpower/flash or Bootshine/Twins Snakes/Snap Punch or Heavy Thrust worked. I can forgive Brayflox, but not Qarn or Vigil. You can't get past any dungeon lv35+ without knowing your job...

Ran a friend through AV a few days ago. The DRG and BLM that were DF'ed had never cleared it, and were good people, very willing to learn. (I was WHM, friend was PLD)

But no matter how well it worked (we won with a few wipes, but it was fine, they were so happy to have someone who helped them out), it still was incredibly grating to see a DRG who has no idea what Heavy Thrust does...and just spams Impulse Drive and Disembowel without triggering the combo...helped him get things sorted a bit, but still...it was AV...

Yeah, I don't like Fate grinding and am so glad Dungeon XP is getting buffed. Leveling my WAR, WHM and SCH I made sure to run dungeons to learn my class in between grinding. Sadly, most people don't do that

[Joygasm]

Theres a lot to be learned by reading.

But theres a lot more to be learned by doing.

I agree. Doing FATEs isn't going to stop you from learning your class. Shy of forcing people to group the entire way up (which I am a fan of old school grouping for experience), you cannot prevent getting people hitting cap without experience doing their role in a party system to an extensive degree.

We aren't talking about a complicated combat system with this game. I'm not trying to make a swipe, I love this game, but its about as simple as you can get save having the abilities say "PUSH ME FOR THREAT" "PUSH ME FIRST" "PUSH ME SECOND"

[NoRyoKu]

... Most people just don't bother with that once they realize that Flash -> Flash -> Flash -> run away gives them easy Gold on everything.

If u do that in my fate party, i'm kicking you out, when i'm in a FATE party, I want everybody to participate in the fate the best they can. If a member just hit and run all the time, he's out, if a healer doesn't heal and just DPS for the XP, he's out. FATE parties are "PARTIES", not group of people who doesn't care

[Victus]

Main story quest line (forced dungeon runs and primals) help curve this issue but I don't feel it absolves it. Honestly, it's a non-issue if you /sh to form groups in end-game. If you run into an incompetent player failing to capitalize on their jobs abilities then you have a couple options. Ask them why they're not doing X Y and Z, they respond with either calling you a noob and demanding you don't tell them how to play their class or they say they didn't know. If they respond with the prior it becomes a clear choice to simply drop them and move on and don't invite them further. If it's them not knowing, possibly help them understand and run lower level dungeons with them to slowly have them learn skills. I'm not saying it's your responsibility to aid them but it's the holistic approach. It will be clear and evident they didn't level properly.

[Avengedangel]

What scares me is that I've seen Paladins in Stone Vigil spamming the living crap out of Rage of Halone (not comboing, just the skill alone). Worries me that people can actually get that far without learning how their combos work (especially the main one), and thank goodness the ones I ran with were fine with taking advice though.

In my opinion, it's fine to FATE grind, but it really helps way more (skill wise) to add a bit of dungeon grinding in-between.

[NyneAlexander]

If u do that in my fate party, i'm kicking you out, when i'm in a FATE party, I want everybody to participate in the fate the best they can. If a member just hit and run all the time, he's out, if a healer doesn't heal and just DPS for the XP, he's out. FATE parties are "PARTIES", not group of people who doesn't care

This mentality would work if performing the skills of your job correctly guaranteed a gold medal/max xp. As it stands now, you can go to a fate as a healer, spend the entire time healing everyone in your party, and not get a gold medal. You can't hate on people for trying to maximize their XP in a broken system.

[OldGeezer]

So, I just participated in my first real chunk of fate grinding this past week, trying to get MAR up to 30 in Quarrymill. Initially, it was at lvl 19 or so as I was just derping around on it while waiting for DF queues for DRG. I only ever leveled it at all because of the Dragoon job requirements, but after learning I'd want Mercy Stroke for my dragoon endgame repertoire, I figured I'd shoot past level 26 and at least start working on qualifying for Warrior...

Tanking FATES doesn't teach you how to tank dungeons. It teaches you to grab aggro but not maintain it for multiple targets. Many starting tanks know to use an AOE aggro on the initial pull, the problem is that they forget to do it after the initial pull. By the time they get to the third or fourth target a healer or arcanist with Bane has pulled aggro. Additioanlly, FATE grinding doesn't teach you the rotation to optimize hate when you have DPS that hit really hard.

[Billie21]

FATE parties are "PARTIES", not group of people who doesn't care

They could (and can) be.
Most of the time though, it's the opposite.
What is sad, is that the game rewards the later as much, if not more than the former.

From my experience, you are the exception to the rule. At least in the regions with big rewarding FATEs.