Please add Hybrid role to dungeon finder queue and fix class design

[Allyrion]

Usually the problem with support is how useful it gets in larger groups and how useless it is in smaller groups by comparison.
A support would probably be balanced around an 8 man party, which would make them weak in 4 mans.

If you required a support for each group, you'd be segregating the roles by a huge amount and queue times will go up like crazy. This may have worked with a 5 man party for dungeons, but it's unlikely with four.

You'd also have to give them enough damage for soloing, since then it'd just be hard on them outside of raids. But you can't give them enough damage or people will just stack support and they'll all buff each other into an Omega Weapon. It's really a balancing nightmare.

I like support classes. I mean, TRUE support not just subpar dps with some extra healing. The ones that manages multiple damage, healing and defensive buffs. It's just horrible to balance and players complain if they're useless outside of raids (which is reasonable).

IF, however, you could scale the balance to the party size and maybe the amount of other support (limit stacking of buffs), then it may work. However, there's already only four dps slots per raid(calling 8 mans a raid, bite me) and 2 per dungeon, so this may divide the roles too much.
Support works better with bigger groups.

[Nofacekiller]

stuff

Pretty easy problems to fix. Give them buffs or stances that help them solo monsters so they can level up, and scale their buffs based on party size.

[Nofacekiller]

Also make their buffs scale on party size like you said, or make it so only 2 buffs of each type maximum can be on a player at a time, so you won't see 3 bard stacking, etc for raids.


I'm looking more towards a burning crusade shadow priest balance ballpark. Probably like 60-70% of the dps of pure dps classes but utility that makes up for it.

[Shamirah]

The problem with support class... is that in progress they're good. When you're geared, they're useless 'cause you can zerk.

[Duelle]

The problem with support class... is that in progress they're good. When you're geared, they're useless 'cause you can zerk.

FFXI proved this also applies to tanks. >.>

Sometimes raw dps/healing isn't required to be useful or even vital to a party's success.

You mean because shadow priests were mana batteries, which is only a quarter-step above being relegated to cure-botting? It wasn't much of an upgrade.

It still wouldn't work. Firstly because bard already has a cooldown for TP and MP regen (and BRD is DPS). Second because you'd make getting a group together infinitely more difficult and much more time-consuming. In case you forgot, finding "support" was always what would make or break a party, moreso than a tank or healer would.

[Lecreuset]

The problem with support class... is that in progress they're good. When you're geared, they're useless 'cause you can zerk.

My group doesn't even need any of my songs in T5 anymore. It took us awhile to down it on our first time because we didn't have much attempts on.. people's schedule and all, but even our first kill on twintania I never had to use ballad or army's paeon or even foe requiem.. atleast I still do decent dps for now but that's slightly getting nerfed/adjusted come 2.1

[Royal]

I would like them to implement support/debuff classes but instead make regular dungeons 5 instead of 4 and leave 8/24 parties alone.

[Pinworms]

Can't add a hybrid class when there are none...if your talking about BRD then it's a support class, and it's the only one ATM. So all you would end up doing is extending your que times to fill the spot for the single support job currently and every group would have a BRD.

[Eriane]

Also make their buffs scale on party size like you said, or make it so only 2 buffs of each type maximum can be on a player at a time, so you won't see 3 bard stacking, etc for raids.


I'm looking more towards a burning crusade shadow priest balance ballpark. Probably like 60-70% of the dps of pure dps classes but utility that makes up for it.

That kind of utility is wasted if you don't have the right party comp. It would not be worth the damage loss. I played a shadow priest in wow bc and in a melee group i was just a lesser dps even in sunwell gear.

If you are talking about multiple types of ultility that you can activate while having reduced dps... well... *points at a bard*

[Nofacekiller]

FFXI proved this also applies to tanks. >.>
You mean because shadow priests were mana batteries, which is only a quarter-step above being relegated to cure-botting? It wasn't much of an upgrade.

It still wouldn't work. Firstly because bard already has a cooldown for TP and MP regen (and BRD is DPS). Second because you'd make getting a group together infinitely more difficult and much more time-consuming. In case you forgot, finding "support" was always what would make or break a party, moreso than a tank or healer would.

Shadow priests also brought passive healing via vampiric embrace and increased magic damage for the entire raid via misery.


One step above cure-botting? This is the DPS meter mentality I'm talking about. Had blizzard removed their mana restoration from vampiric touch, their rotation would not have changed.